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HD DVD or BluRay

G

Ginseng

Banned
Joined
Oct 2, 2005
Messages
8,802
Hi guys,

We'll be thinking about upgrading to an all new digital AV entertainment system in two years. To sort of get a feel for what's going on in the biz, I went to Circuit City and spent some time ogling their HD source (player) and display (television) selection. The 1080p DLP displays fed by a 1080p signal were simply stunning.

It looks like the HD DVD players are starting to see the light of day with HD DVD coming from Toshiba and a BluRay player from Samsung.

My question for the AV nuts is which system do you think will win out and why? They both support 1080i with HD DVD holding 30GB/disk and BluRay holding 50GB. I don't suppose both formats will flourish.

Any ideas and comments would be appreciated.

Wilkey
 
at this point, i would hold off on buying anything blu-ray / hd-dvd. like the dvd writer format wars of the past (remember the DVD+R / DVD-R stuff which is still going on and they can co-exist). i think it is all going to depend on which big companies get behind a specific format (sony, etc) and really push it onto us, but also i feel they will co-exist like the dvd writer stuff has for 5+ years.
i recently grabbed a DVD player from sony (it upverts to 1080i with an HDMI connection) for under 200 dollars. PQ is excellent and to my eyes looks like native 1080i.
i gotta say, with all the standard DVD's out there being produced,and standard DVD players that most people have, it's gonna be a while for a new format to catch on.
i know a little about this stuff, AVB and Alex are the a/v nuts around here, they can probably enlighten a little more.
also, check here, these guys can answer everything about this stuff....
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=18

edit to add comment and eliminated HD infront of DVD
 
Thanks, Rob.

The situation strikes me as somewhat analogous to that surrounding the two hi-end audio CD formats. Right now, I can't even recall what they were called. DVD-Audio was one, I think.

Wilkey
 
Super Audio CD was the other aka: SACD
 
I'm gonna brag and say I'm most likely the biggest Home Theater geek here. (I also run an HT board on the side) My advice is the same as Rob's......hold off for now, espscially if you don't have a display that can handle all that HD-DVD can offer, namely 1080P.

As an FYI, a DVD player that upconverts is not HD-DVD.
 
HD-DVD Vs. Blu-Ray feels like the "Beta Vs. VHS" battle of years past.... :p I'd think waiting would be sound advice.

...but, if you are going to buy a new "big" TV (as we're about to), it would seem short sighted to buy one that won't do 1080, would you agree, AVB..? Or, is that standard going to change as well...??

Thanks - B.B.S.
 
1080P (Progressive) is the key not just 1080I (Interlaced). You might want to look into a projector instead of a wall mount or framed unit too since they can be adjusted for size. Small for TV or larger for sports/movies for example. There are some decent paints available that are close to actual screen properties that so you can use a smooth wall as a screen.
 
PS3 will be released later this year with Blu-Ray. I believe this will cement Blu-Ray as the leader. I'm also of the opinion that it is the superior format, albeit slightly.
 
Strayvector said:
Here's an interesting article on Sony's big bet on bluray:

http://money.cnn.com/2006/05/30/magazines/...rtune/index.htm

Of course, history tells us that Sony also backed the Betamax, but maybe they learned from their past mistake and are now backing the technology with greater storage.
Click to expand...
If I remember my hardware correctly, there was little doubt that BetaMax was the superior format (U-matic professional stuff is still used somewhat today). As I recall, what killed BetaMax was the exorbatant licensing fees Sony thought they could get. Panasonic (Matsushita) had an acceptable format with VHS and was more accomodating when it came to enabling other hardware folks in producing the goods.

We'll see how successful Sony's reported $600.00 PS3 / BluRay console really is.... :cool:

Cheers - B.B.S.
 
BlindedByScience said:
Strayvector said:
Here's an interesting article on Sony's big bet on bluray:

http://money.cnn.com/2006/05/30/magazines/...rtune/index.htm

Of course, history tells us that Sony also backed the Betamax, but maybe they learned from their past mistake and are now backing the technology with greater storage.
Click to expand...
If I remember my hardware correctly, there was little doubt that BetaMax was the superior format (U-matic professional stuff is still used somewhat today). As I recall, what killed BetaMax was the exorbatant licensing fees Sony thought they could get. Panasonic (Matsushita) had an acceptable format with VHS and was more accomodating when it came to enabling other hardware folks in producing the goods.

We'll see how successful Sony's reported $600.00 PS3 / BluRay console really is.... :cool:

Cheers - B.B.S.
Click to expand...

the PS3 will probably be cheaper than that around Christmas to try and boot the new Xbox, agreed on the betamax stuff, sony really screwed themselves there.
 
Hey gang,
If there's a bet, I'll say BlueRay. I don't know enough about it, so that opinion is a guesstimate more than anything else. If the Blueray players upconvert old DVDs, then I'll probably be upgrading to BlueRay, though I'd need a new TV too. Ah hell, why not eh? Hahhaha

As a collector of rare films and tv appearances of rock acts, I still use Umatic, BetaSP, and on occassion Beta. I can remember when Beta vs VHS was raging (showing me age well! hahah ??? ).

Now, not to thread jack, but I'm looking into getting a new PC speaker system and want something that reproduces the sound very accurately. AVB, Alex, any suggestions? So far I"ve been considering Cambridge Soundworks Microworks II and Harman Kardon Soundsticks 2. Any help would be greatly appreciated (email me at green1224@adelphia.net).

Great thread,
Darren
 
Strayvector said:
Of course, history tells us that Sony also backed the Betamax, but maybe they learned from their past mistake and are now backing the technology with greater storage.
Click to expand...

I'm not so sure, Sam. Didn't they come out with ATRAC compression for audio and MicroMV tape as a competitor for MiniDV. I'm pretty sure neither of those could be considered successful.

Of course, neither were the colossal failure that the APS film format was. Ugh.

Wilkey
 
ATRAC (as a compression format wasn't) but the Minidisc format was/is actually very successful in the overseas market. They are still producing up to date current models of hardware to this day. The MD format just never caught on very well here in the states.

Unfortunately they keep trying to push the ATRAC music compression format which is not as successful. I'm by no means an expert, but up until recently have been a user and fan of the MD format for quite a few years. Sony just kept pushing the ATRAC too far and never caught on to what the users wanted (or cared perhaps).

I have already hopped on the iPOD bandwagon and it was the best thing I have done in a long time in regards to audio. I will be dumping all my MD gear very soon..

*edit* wow just realized how off topic this rant against MD and ATRAC was to the original post. My apologies.
 
Ginseng said:
Hi guys,

We'll be thinking about upgrading to an all new digital AV entertainment system in two years. To sort of get a feel for what's going on in the biz, I went to Circuit City and spent some time ogling their HD source (player) and display (television) selection. The 1080p DLP displays fed by a 1080p signal were simply stunning.

It looks like the HD DVD players are starting to see the light of day with HD DVD coming from Toshiba and a BluRay player from Samsung.

My question for the AV nuts is which system do you think will win out and why? They both support 1080i with HD DVD holding 30GB/disk and BluRay holding 50GB. I don't suppose both formats will flourish.

Any ideas and comments would be appreciated.

Wilkey
Click to expand...


If the quality is the same, why would anyone want HD DVD when it only holds 30GB as compared to BluRay at 50GB? It would seem that BluRay is the superior format.
 
Fusact,
Thanks for the interesting diversion! It's entirely in the spirit of the discussion about alternative standards.

Zee,
My point exactly. One thing that's not clear to me though. Is even Blu-Ray capable of delivering 1080p?

Note: I found this interesting site High Def Forum - HD subforum

Wilkey
 
i spent hours in that forum when looking for my dvd and tv, learned and forgot alot
 
Rob_k said:
i spent hours in that forum when looking for my dvd and tv, learned and forgot alot
Click to expand...

Roger that.

I have neither the desire nor the interest to delve into the topic at that level. I guess when we do upgrade, it'll probably be with the advice of the AV nuts here and perhaps some professionals as well.

Wilkey
 
Ginseng said:
Rob_k said:
i spent hours in that forum when looking for my dvd and tv, learned and forgot alot
Click to expand...

Roger that.

I have neither the desire nor the interest to delve into the topic at that level. I guess when we do upgrade, it'll probably be with the advice of the AV nuts here and perhaps some professionals as well.

Wilkey
Click to expand...
i guess the same could be said of this "hobby" we partake in. you can go as deep as you want to with any hobby. my other hobby (photography) puts a drain on the wallet as well.
i am on your side wilkey, i will let the AV heads help me sort through all this. i am very happy right now with my setup, sounds good and to my eyes, looks great. nice educational thread here.
 
Storage size alone will not win out in the consumer audio market. Like DAT before it, there may be a market in the business area for 50GB vs 30GB storage but unless they make it re-writeable with a lost bit rate of better then 1 per hundred million even that will be in doubt.

Sony's record of pushing or picking the more consumer friendly technology is not all that good over the last 3 decades. They do great on the pro side of the house but Beta, mini-disc, SACD, El-cassette, Ferri-chrome cassettes, the mentioned compression schemes and a few other ideas didn't do well.

Mini-discs don't sound that great and only did really well in Japan itself. Other Asian markets were luke warm but still better then the US. MP3 is even worse sound wise but the convieniance factor is driving the Ipod, not the sound quality.
 
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