Bizarre situation in Indianapolis

[Lumberg]

So the rules in F1 dictate that teams must use the same tires for the entire weekend--practice, qualifying, and race. There are two makes of tires used in F1 racing: Bridgestone, and Michelin, which supplies the majority of the cars (14 of 22 I believe).

In practice a pair of Michelin tires failed. After examining the tires Michelin has said they cannot guarantee the tire to hold up, and thus the safety of the drivers in the fastest corner of the racetrack. They asked F1 to put a chicane in turn 13. F1 said this is out of the question--why change the track just to help the teams who run the Michelins?

F1 basically gave the teams three options: go slower voluntarily, change the left rear tires every 10 laps (Michelin says they can guarantee the tires for 10 laps only), subject to valid safety reasons, or race on diferent tires, which would incur a stiff penalty.

There is doubt as to whether the Michelin teams will race. At first they were going to boycott the race. Now it looks like they will all line up, run one lap, and retire.

Should make for an interesting race.

 

[Lumberg]

Looks like there are only 6 cars racing. Fans are throwing things on to the track.

I think FIA did the right thing. Looks like Schumacher (who races Bridgestones) will be able to improve his championship position this week.

 

[Gonz]

Looks like this turned out poorly. Especially since F1 racing has yet to catch on in the US.

 

[inflatus]

Another setback for F1 racing. I wish it would catch on here, but it does not seem like it will.

 

[OutlawD]

they should have moved responsibilty for monetary penalties to michelin and allowed drivers to use bridgestone tires. it was michelins fault.not the drivers and teams.

 

[Lumberg]

they should have moved responsibilty for monetary penalties to michelin and allowed drivers to use bridgestone tires. it was michelins fault.not the drivers and teams.

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You know my mom asked the same question--why didn't the teams just switch to Bridgestone tires?

My speculative answer was twofold:

a) these machines are so precisely tuned, changing to a different brand of tire with different adhestion and deflection characteristics immediately prior to a race (with no practice) would probably be as dangerous as running the original Michelins.

b) Regardless of how bad Michelin ****ed up, the teams probably have a big-money contract to use Michelin tires exclusively and it could have resulted in some serious legal trouble.

I think F1 conducted itself with steady professionalism and fairness. Anyone who blames F1 or FIA for the result is dumb. Rules are rules.

 

[Lumberg]

Oh and thirdly, who knows if Bridgestone had enough tires on hand to equip 20 cars?

 

[Gonz]

a) these machines are so precisely tuned, changing to a different brand of tire with different adhestion and deflection characteristics immediately prior to a race (with no practice) would probably be as dangerous as running the original Michelins.

That's exactly how I feel about my car! Sure, some call it everyday driving, but it's all really about performance! :whistling:

 

[Allofus123]

I think F1 conducted itself with steady professionalism and fairness. Anyone who blames F1 or FIA for the result is dumb. Rules are rules.

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Totally agree..... the blame falls squarly on Michelin for having a componemt of the race car not able to perform. Michelin should step up and refund the fans money.

 

[mrjinglesusa]

That race was a complete farce. I love F1, but that "race" was a joke and the blame falls squarely on Michelin and the FIA. Michelin were unprepared and brought the wrong tires to the race. Bridgestone got it right so it was NOT the tracks fault. The FIA is partly responsible for this fiasco for not being willing to compromise and allow a chicane to be put in before turn 13 - even if the race was non-sanctioned and not for championship points. Then again, many teams would not spend the over $250,000 it costs to actually race their cars if no points were up for grabs. Truly a sad day for F1 in the US. It was completely CLASSLESS and borderline criminal for people to be throwing things on the track however. :angry2:

It is not the responsibility of Bridgestone to provide the proper tires to the other, Michelin running teams. They had a choice, chose Michelin, and paid the price at this race. If it were the other way around and the Bridgestone tires were failing, no one would expect Michelin to give them tires. Just because it was 14 cars instead of 6 people think this was an option.

Bottom line - the FIA should have allowed a chicane to be put in, the race should have gone on as a non-sanctioned event, and the teams should have put on a show. :sign:

 

[mrjinglesusa]

I think F1 conducted itself with steady professionalism and fairness. Anyone who blames F1 or FIA for the result is dumb. Rules are rules.

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I disagree. The race should have been run as a NON-SANCTIONED event with a chicane before turn 13. Fans paid good money, took vacation time, traveled from all over the WORLD to see this race. There should have been 20 cars out there no matter what kind of compromise it took, even if it wasn't for championship points. They could have used it for testing, whatever. To do a formation lap and then pull into the pits was a complete and utter joke. And I am saying this as a Michael Schumacher fan. :sign:

 

[Lumberg]

The FIA is partly responsible for this fiasco for not being willing to compromise and allow a chicane to be put in before turn 13 - even if the race was non-sanctioned and not for championship points. 

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Wrong. If the FIA were to do that they would effectively be penalizing the Bridgestone teams, who came prepared to race for points.

"Yeah so we're sorry, we know you came totally prepared to race in a sanctioned event for the full reward due to those who put in the effort to race, but since the OTHER teams were not prepared, not only will the other teams not earn points, neither will you."

I could maybe see that if F1 were willing to somehow guarantee that the teams that were actually prepared to race in a sanctioned event, but the race still had to be run to determine how the points actually awarded would be spread out.

Or if the race were run with the chicane and the only the finishers with Bridgestone tires would get points. Ie if the finishing order Were Raikonnen Montoya Schumacher Fishiella Coulthard Barrichello Albers Schumi would still get 1st place points, Barrichello would get second, Albers would get the podium finish, etc.

However if you did that what is the point of the Michelin teams competing and spending their money and effort? Also you still have the problem of a) effectively penalizing the Bridgestone teams by changing the layout of the course to cater to the needs of teams with Michelin tires, and b) putting on a race on a track configuration upon which absolutely zero practice was held.

Edit: I think the Michelin teams had new sets of tires airlifted in from France. I'm not sure if the issue was that the replacement tires were also defective, or that F1 said they could race with the tires and get no points. I think it was the latter, and so the exact situation stated in the first sentence of the paragraph took place.

Michelin screwed up. I don't think anyone who thinks differently is being rational. Racing to a certain extent is for entertainment. However the whole reason people get together and form leagues and associations is to ensure fairness. I can't think of a single outcome that would have both been fair and allowed the Michelin teams to race, other than if the Michelin teams voluntarily slowed down in turn 13, and there were basically two races within the race--the Bridgestone teams racing for positions 1-6 and the Michelin teams basically racing for 7th. It would have worked much like Le Mans where there are several categories of cars all racing at the same time, each slower than the next, and the slower cars basically have to make room for the faster cars out of respect,a nd they are only racing within their class.

 

[mrjinglesusa]

After reading some things on www.itv-f1.com and your posts I think I have to agree with you. Michelin should have provided 2 sets of tires - a high-performance, race-winning tire and a low-performance, completely reliable tire. They did not provide either in this case. As a race fan, I would have liked to see 20 cars out there racing, but as you said, this wouldn't have been much of a "race" either. Michelin screwed up, plain and simple, and the teams that pulled out should be penalized heavily. One commentor even went so far as to say they should lose ALL their championship points. Not sure I agree with that, but there needs to be SOME kind of penalty, both to Michelin and to the individual teams for failing to compete.

I also didn't realize the FIA suggested that the teams SLOW DOWN before that turn and be penalized if they failed to do so. Seems to me this would have been an ideal solution.

 

[Lumberg]

Well the slowing down thing was a thorny issue; how much to slow down? How to make a racer overcome his instinct to go as fast as possible? What if the slower cars got in the way?

I don't think the teams who didn't race should be penalized. They acted in the best interests of the drivers and teams.

Michelin should be banned from participating in F1 for like 5 years, effective immediately.

F1 was already planning to go to a spec tire next year anyway, sorta like NASCAR; this would eliminate the problem entirely.

 

[Lumberg]

I must admit I was transfixed by this story. Before the race I went to the FIA website and they had posted all the correspondece that took place between Michelin and F1 leading up to race (they had scanned in faxes as PDFs, everything). The exchanges are very informative. I highly recommend reading them if you're interested in this at all.

 

[Savage112]

Bottom line is this would not exist without the fans.

Make it right with them and do not let this happen again.

 

[ads47]

I think the local feelings around here were summed up by one of the local sports writers in yesterdays paper "F1 dont the door hit ya where the good lord split ya"

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