Newbie Pass 101

[Joebunaga]

And for the record, I lasted at least two minutes, nothing premature about that

_craig_

Hell, you're a marathon man :thumbs: !

T(5) Arturo Fuente WOAM (2010)
P(31) Arturo Fuente Anejo NO. 50 (2006)

T(26) Padron 5000 Maduro
P(32) Rocky Patel Vintage 1990 Toro

By vitola standards the first p/t is fine, but now we get into aging as well. It seems like the Anejo would be worth more with an extra 4 years of aging. Not sure how that affects pricing.

With the second p/t I'm seeing the Rocky as more than 15% more valuable. Again we're only talking a little over a buck, but...

The other 2 p/ts look good.

My .02

 

[Nashkicker]

If you guys keep overputting by $1 or more, by the time this pass reaches the halfway mark you will hvae priced a lot of your fellow newbs out of the pass! Just a little food for thought.

 

[ilikefishes]

If you guys keep overputting by $1 or more, by the time this pass reaches the halfway mark you will hvae priced a lot of your fellow newbs out of the pass! Just a little food for thought.

Agreed, that is something that is very important to watch. Don't get me wrong, I love the puts. But it will get out of hand if it continues.

 

[Lil_mac14]

If you guys keep overputting by $1 or more, by the time this pass reaches the halfway mark you will hvae priced a lot of your fellow newbs out of the pass! Just a little food for thought.

Agreed, that is something that is very important to watch. Don't get me wrong, I love the puts. But it will get out of hand if it continues.

I also agree, after looking back over my "master list" of cigars on hand, I can change the second P/T to:

T(26) Padron 5000 Maduro
P(32) Arturo Fuente Hemingway Signature

For these I have the pricing as follows:

Padron 5000 Maduro
--(SeriousCigars) $6.25
--(Holts) $6.80
--(SmokeInn) $6.45
Average = $6.50

Arturo Fuente Hemingway Signature
--(SeriousCigars) $6.60
--(Holts) $6.60
--(SmokeInn) $6.55
Average = $6.56

Also, if the age on the Anejo 50 bumps up the value too much, the master list claims that I have one from 2010, I'll dig for it and report back on that.

_craig_

 

[Bsneed51]

4 years isn't really "aged" enough to add much, if any, extra value. I don't think there is any hard and fast rule on aging adding value, especially when it comes to non cuban cigars, but I think it would really have to be in the 6+ range to really make much difference, even if any then. Ultimately this is Jake's pass so he has the final say, but just adding my perspective. Once you get into higher end passes you will see that a large majority of the sticks involved have 4-10 or more years of age on them, and when you start trying to hard to match, price, rarity, and age you end up making things way to complicated.

Besides, once you've been in this for a while, you will find that 4 years isn't really aging, that's just how long it takes you to remember that you have some cigars still in your humidor. :laugh:

 

[BigJake6904]

Now I will add this on over-puts. My point of teaching this in the pass is only to be courteous to other passers...I've never seen an over-put shot down in a pass. Sometimes, it gets out of control...$5-$10 over puts, when done repeatedly, can really skew things. However, when you participate in other passes, realize that an over put up to a couple dollars isn't that big of a deal. That's where adding extra sticks into a pass comes in. Is it an over-put? Yes, absolutely...you took nothing and only added value. However, you also increased the selection size. Say you did this with a $15 cigar...are you hurting the pass, or not? I'd vote no. Obviously that's not the circumstance here...but when you get released into the world of other passes after having participated in the Newbie gateway...I don't want everyone to point fingers or be sticklers at every over-put you see....sometimes, depending on your collection, an overput to some degree is the only way to go.

Rarity should be based on production until a certain point where age can become a factor. I'd say that's probably when you get past the 8 year old marker for common sticks and probably 5 years for rarer cigars and cigars out of production.

This is a estimate from me, and a quote from the first page. I'd say it being an '06 (5 years old) is walking a fine line for me...but if anything...it doesn't add a significant amount to the stick, though I'd agree it'd bump it some. This is one of those gray areas you can't put a price on...but since It's a put and not a take...it's obviously good.

 

[Joebunaga]

Sounds good, sorry if I'm commenting too much. I just want to learn as much as I can.

 

[Set-In-Stone]

Newbie Qs for the big man (Jake) .... I read the cover page again and saw nothing on Cub. cigars. Are Johnny-O! sticks allowed in this pass ?

Also, lets say I had my eye on a particular stick that averaged to be $ 6.82, and I planned on replacing it with a stick thats MSRP is $ 6.67. Now the stick I would like to put in at $ 6.67 was a LE and only 333 boxes of 15 were made. Clearly it's a HTF stick and a sought after one at that, so would that justify the slight shortage in that department ?

What are the rest of the community's thoughts on this ??

 

[BigJake6904]

Newbie Qs for the big man (Jake) .... I read the cover page again and saw nothing on Cub. cigars. Are Johnny-O! sticks allowed in this pass ?

Also, lets say I had my eye on a particular stick that averaged to be $ 6.82, and I planned on replacing it with a stick thats MSRP is $ 6.67. Now the stick I would like to put in at $ 6.67 was a LE and only 333 boxes of 15 were made. Clearly it's a HTF stick and a sought after one at that, so would that justify the slight shortage in that department ?

What are the rest of the community's thoughts on this ??

Yes, rarity makes up for pricing (to some extent).

ISOM's are not in this pass. In most of the passes I run, I allow ISOM's and NC's and cross P/T's for both...however, for this pass, there will be no ISOM's.

 

[ilikefishes]

Newbie Qs for the big man (Jake) .... I read the cover page again and saw nothing on Cub. cigars. Are Johnny-O! sticks allowed in this pass ?

Also, lets say I had my eye on a particular stick that averaged to be $ 6.82, and I planned on replacing it with a stick thats MSRP is $ 6.67. Now the stick I would like to put in at $ 6.67 was a LE and only 333 boxes of 15 were made. Clearly it's a HTF stick and a sought after one at that, so would that justify the slight shortage in that department ?

What are the rest of the community's thoughts on this ??

I would welcome this as well, provided you followed the no ISOM rule.

 

[MarkJr]

I sent the pass out this morning, the DC# 0309 3220 0000 5016 3589.

 

[mjolnir01]

I also agree, after looking back over my "master list" of cigars on hand, I can change the second P/T to:

T(26) Padron 5000 Maduro
P(32) Arturo Fuente Hemingway Signature

For these I have the pricing as follows:

Padron 5000 Maduro
--(SeriousCigars) $6.25
--(Holts) $6.80
--(SmokeInn) $6.45
Average = $6.50

Arturo Fuente Hemingway Signature
--(SeriousCigars) $6.60
--(Holts) $6.60
--(SmokeInn) $6.55
Average = $6.56

Also, if the age on the Anejo 50 bumps up the value too much, the master list claims that I have one from 2010, I'll dig for it and report back on that.

_craig_

Craig, looks good to me.

Besides, once you've been in this for a while, you will find that 4 years isn't really aging, that's just how long it takes you to remember that you have some cigars still in your humidor. :laugh:

Very true.

 

[2K6TBSS]

Just got off the phone with Mark. Due to lack of transportation on my part, the pass looks like it'll be mailed out Monday morning. It's not going very far so it should definitely be here before the holiday.

Here are my proposed Puts/Takes. Let me know what you guys think, and if necessary I can adjust accordingly.

T(5) Arturo Fuente WOAM (2010)
P(31) Arturo Fuente Anejo NO. 50 (2006)

T(2) Arturo Fuente Gran Reserva Chateau Fuente
P(33) 5 Vegas Serie 'A' Apex

T(27) Illusione Epernay Le Matin
P(34) Ashton VSG Torpedo

T(26) Padron 5000 Maduro
P(32) Arturo Fuente Hemingway Signature

These all look good to me.

 

[Lil_mac14]

Looks like the pass should make it here tomorrow. Again, here are the finalized P/T's that I have.

T(5) Arturo Fuente WOAM (2010)
P(31) Arturo Fuente Anejo NO. 50 (2006)

T(26) Padron 5000 Maduro
P(32) Arturo Fuente Hemingway Signature

T(2) Arturo Fuente Gran Reserva Chateau Fuente
P(33) 5 Vegas Serie 'A' Apex

T(27) Illusione Epernay Le Matin
P(34) Ashton VSG Torpedo

Now, here's my question. With the pass getting here tomorrow, there should be no problem on my part to have this thing shipped out on wednesday. Paul, I'm not sure if you want to try to meet up, with it being Thanksgiving and everything (not sure what kinda time you'll have). Obviously meeting up thursday would be out of the question. We could try to figure out sometime that would work well for both of us, if not, just let me know and I can ship it out to you.

How do you guys think that the holiday will effect shipping? I would hate to have this thing sitting in some warehouse until next week.

_craig_

 

[Gern Blansten]

Looks like the pass should make it here tomorrow. Again, here are the finalized P/T's that I have.

T(5) Arturo Fuente WOAM (2010)
P(31) Arturo Fuente Anejo NO. 50 (2006)

T(26) Padron 5000 Maduro
P(32) Arturo Fuente Hemingway Signature

T(2) Arturo Fuente Gran Reserva Chateau Fuente
P(33) 5 Vegas Serie 'A' Apex

T(27) Illusione Epernay Le Matin
P(34) Ashton VSG Torpedo

Sorry, I have been out of the loop on vacation. These look fine to me. Looks like you'll have a few nice smokes to burn after the bird!

 

[Tall Paul]

Looks like the pass should make it here tomorrow. Again, here are the finalized P/T's that I have.

T(5) Arturo Fuente WOAM (2010)
P(31) Arturo Fuente Anejo NO. 50 (2006)

T(26) Padron 5000 Maduro
P(32) Arturo Fuente Hemingway Signature

T(2) Arturo Fuente Gran Reserva Chateau Fuente
P(33) 5 Vegas Serie 'A' Apex

T(27) Illusione Epernay Le Matin
P(34) Ashton VSG Torpedo

Now, here's my question. With the pass getting here tomorrow, there should be no problem on my part to have this thing shipped out on wednesday. Paul, I'm not sure if you want to try to meet up, with it being Thanksgiving and everything (not sure what kinda time you'll have). Obviously meeting up thursday would be out of the question. We could try to figure out sometime that would work well for both of us, if not, just let me know and I can ship it out to you.

How do you guys think that the holiday will effect shipping? I would hate to have this thing sitting in some warehouse until next week.

_craig_

Craig I am down for meeting up if it works for you. I have weekends off so Saturday looks great for me. But if it doesn't work I dont think shipping will be a problem. I am not sure but I don't think USPS or UPS have Friday off.

Where in Boston are you at?

Paul

 

[Set-In-Stone]

Newbie Qs for the big man (Jake) .... I read the cover page again and saw nothing on Cub. cigars. Are Johnny-O! sticks allowed in this pass ?

Also, lets say I had my eye on a particular stick that averaged to be $ 6.82, and I planned on replacing it with a stick thats MSRP is $ 6.67. Now the stick I would like to put in at $ 6.67 was a LE and only 333 boxes of 15 were made. Clearly it's a HTF stick and a sought after one at that, so would that justify the slight shortage in that department ?

What are the rest of the community's thoughts on this ??

Yes, rarity makes up for pricing (to some extent).

ISOM's are not in this pass. In most of the passes I run, I allow ISOM's and NC's and cross P/T's for both...however, for this pass, there will be no ISOM's.

Understood.... thanks for clearing that up for me sir.

 

[2K6TBSS]

Was going to send Jake a PM, but thought I would bring this public. A possible learning experience for all...

I have a few questions about cigar pricing.

1 - I have some sticks that are from the CRA Samplers that have been released. Some of the sticks are regular production (just with a CRA band on the foot). But some of the sticks are CRA exclusive, meaning they are a "special" size that isn't available except for through the CRA Sampler. Since the samplers were $100 for 10 sticks ($10/stick) does that mean that the CRA "special" sticks should be considered a $10 stick in this pass? Or should these cigars be considered not useable in this pass since there is no real vendor comparison that can be done?

2 - I have a few cigars that I am having a really hard time finding pricing on. Based on either age, possibly rarity, or just Google-fu skills are not working properly. Hoping maybe some other guys here can maybe use their Google-fu to help me find some additional information (or pricing).

- Camacho Liberty Amendment XII (from 2004)
The only pricing I can find on this stick is http://www.chiefcatoonah.com/cam-lib04-torp.html which is showing $24.95. There is a lot of forums discussing the cigar, but no vendor sites selling.

- Opus X lost City Lancero (2010)
I have found that Serious Cigars and Jack Schwartz both sell for 29.99. Unfortunately Vitola's doesn't have any information about the Lost City Opus Line. Maybe I should contact Andrew (Moki) about this one?

- La Flor Dominicana mini salomon
I have found a lot for the regular size salamon, but can't find anything about this one.

3 - How do we look at cigars that we paid less than what "average" MSRP is? I have some cigars (maybe 2 or 3) that I paid a few dollars less than what I am finding as "average" MSRP. This is mostly due to the fact that they were purchased from BOTLs on CP. Do I use the price I pad for said cigars, or do I still use the "average" MSRP that I have found by searching various vendors?

 

[BigJake6904]

Was going to send Jake a PM, but thought I would bring this public. A possible learning experience for all...

I have a few questions about cigar pricing.

1 - I have some sticks that are from the CRA Samplers that have been released. Some of the sticks are regular production (just with a CRA band on the foot). But some of the sticks are CRA exclusive, meaning they are a "special" size that isn't available except for through the CRA Sampler. Since the samplers were $100 for 10 sticks ($10/stick) does that mean that the CRA "special" sticks should be considered a $10 stick in this pass? Or should these cigars be considered not useable in this pass since there is no real vendor comparison that can be done? They are $10 Sticks with a slight rarity due to only being released and banded in this limited packaged set.

2 - I have a few cigars that I am having a really hard time finding pricing on. Based on either age, possibly rarity, or just Google-fu skills are not working properly. Hoping maybe some other guys here can maybe use their Google-fu to help me find some additional information (or pricing). Notes in RED below.

- Camacho Liberty Amendment XII (from 2004) -
The only pricing I can find on this stick is http://www.chiefcato...lib04-torp.html which is showing $24.95. There is a lot of forums discussing the cigar, but no vendor sites selling.
All the liberty cigars run roughly the same from year to year. Between $13 and $16 depending where you buy them. http://www.cigarsaroundtheworld.com/cali20.html There is a source where I found the pricing to be in line with this at $14.40.
Now, since a new Camacho Liberty is released every year (though the release is a HUGE quantity of cigars...it would carry some rarity due to the fact you haven't been able to buy this cigar because of 8yrs age. I think $15-$15.50 considering that would be a fair estimate.

- Opus X lost City Lancero (2010)
I have found that Serious Cigars and Jack Schwartz both sell for 29.99. Unfortunately Vitola's doesn't have any information about the Lost City Opus Line. Maybe I should contact Andrew (Moki) about this one?
Here is your MSRP information on this cigar: http://www.fuenteagedselection.com/main/product/2011/lostcitycigar2011.htm $310 a box of 10 is $31/ stick. Only 4000 cigars made...means rarity might play a big role.

- La Flor Dominicana mini salomon
I have found a lot for the regular size salamon, but can't find anything about this one.
Never new this cigar existed. You sure that's the name? I will continue to dig this up.

3 - How do we look at cigars that we paid less than what "average" MSRP is? I have some cigars (maybe 2 or 3) that I paid a few dollars less than what I am finding as "average" MSRP. This is mostly due to the fact that they were purchased from BOTLs on CP. Do I use the price I pad for said cigars, or do I still use the "average" MSRP that I have found by searching various vendors?
A BOTL hooked you up...but it's not profiting, your trading for an equal or lesser value cigar. You use MSRP.

Looks like the pass should make it here tomorrow. Again, here are the finalized P/T's that I have.

T(5) Arturo Fuente WOAM (2010)
P(31) Arturo Fuente Anejo NO. 50 (2006)

T(26) Padron 5000 Maduro
P(32) Arturo Fuente Hemingway Signature

T(2) Arturo Fuente Gran Reserva Chateau Fuente
P(33) 5 Vegas Serie 'A' Apex

T(27) Illusione Epernay Le Matin
P(34) Ashton VSG Torpedo

Now, here's my question. With the pass getting here tomorrow, there should be no problem on my part to have this thing shipped out on wednesday. Paul, I'm not sure if you want to try to meet up, with it being Thanksgiving and everything (not sure what kinda time you'll have). Obviously meeting up thursday would be out of the question. We could try to figure out sometime that would work well for both of us, if not, just let me know and I can ship it out to you.

How do you guys think that the holiday will effect shipping? I would hate to have this thing sitting in some warehouse until next week.

_craig_

Sorry, forgot to respond.....these are good.

The temperature outside isn't bad...that's why we mostly do passes this time of year...sitting in a warehouse now won't do nearly the damage that it would if it was summer time. I'd say it's safe to ship whenever....just use a DC# if you don't do a hand-off.

 

[2K6TBSS]

- La Flor Dominicana mini salomon
I have found a lot for the regular size salamon, but can't find anything about this one.
Never new this cigar existed. You sure that's the name? I will continue to dig this up.

All I know is that I purchased the cigar from Martin2D back in January when he was selling his whole collection. The exact wording he used in his listing was LFD Reserva Especiale Small Salamone. I also searched this, but found nothing. I will take a few pics tonight when I get home so you can see it, maybe you will recognize it and tell me what the real name of the cigar is.