The Green Monkey
Brap-brap
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Cigar Rights of America
- Thread starter CasaSoho
- Start date
Greetings Matt (et al),
This is an excellent discussion and I'm glad to see we're having a dialog on this topic. I also appreciate the CRA Members that have stood-up for the organization. You guys never cease to amaze me!
The core of what CRA does is to fight for our freedom to enjoy cigars, not just publish news or host events. Certainly offering news to our members is a value-added service and who doesn’t like to attend a nice cigar event, but this is not where we focus our efforts.
CRA is VERY active in MANY states across the country. Strategically, CRA does not publish "what we're doing to fight government," because that would be like a football team posting its play book. The nature of how laws are created, approved, and passed is often covert and without public knowledge. While this may seem hard to believe, it's unfortunately true. Further, the process of lobbying is often done behind closed doors in meetings with the legislators themselves. CRA continues to be recognized as a political voice and has been granted access to MANY of these sessions. In fact, CRA’s professional lobbyists and lawyers have drafted policy language and compromises for many local, state, and federal measures.
With that said, we hope that you understand that we cannot share all that we are doing or it would jeopardize our efforts.
It's also important to understand that CRA is going against some of the most power health organizations in the country. In addition, with the largest recession in our history, many governors are looking for ways to bail out their state and are attacking tobacco (cigars) with heavy taxes. That said, it takes thousands upon thousands (and into the millions) of dollars to get our voice heard and affect change. In other words, the last thing legislators want to do is deny a tax revenue source.
To acquire the finances necessary to fight for our freedoms and preserve our precious pleasure, CRA replies on membership dues and donations (remember we are a non-profit). An additional political benefit to having a member base is the ability to have a larger voice in government. It's amazing what happens when you bring a constituency of thousands (and eventually millions) of members to the table in opposition (or support) of a measure.
THE BOTTOM LINE:
We (everyone taking time to post on this thread – and all other cigar enthusiasts) enjoy cigars. Am I right?
You can either spend your time posting and taking stabs at what needs to be done, or what is not being done...OR you can be part of the solution and become a member of CRA. CRA IS the outlet for allowing your voice to be heard. To me, the nominal $35/year membership fee seems to be well worth the upside potential. Don't you agree?
Let's preserve our freedom to enjoy cigars...PLEASE JOIN CRA TODAY!
Sincerely,
Brian Berman
Director of Membership
Cigar Rights of America
This is an excellent discussion and I'm glad to see we're having a dialog on this topic. I also appreciate the CRA Members that have stood-up for the organization. You guys never cease to amaze me!
The core of what CRA does is to fight for our freedom to enjoy cigars, not just publish news or host events. Certainly offering news to our members is a value-added service and who doesn’t like to attend a nice cigar event, but this is not where we focus our efforts.
CRA is VERY active in MANY states across the country. Strategically, CRA does not publish "what we're doing to fight government," because that would be like a football team posting its play book. The nature of how laws are created, approved, and passed is often covert and without public knowledge. While this may seem hard to believe, it's unfortunately true. Further, the process of lobbying is often done behind closed doors in meetings with the legislators themselves. CRA continues to be recognized as a political voice and has been granted access to MANY of these sessions. In fact, CRA’s professional lobbyists and lawyers have drafted policy language and compromises for many local, state, and federal measures.
With that said, we hope that you understand that we cannot share all that we are doing or it would jeopardize our efforts.
It's also important to understand that CRA is going against some of the most power health organizations in the country. In addition, with the largest recession in our history, many governors are looking for ways to bail out their state and are attacking tobacco (cigars) with heavy taxes. That said, it takes thousands upon thousands (and into the millions) of dollars to get our voice heard and affect change. In other words, the last thing legislators want to do is deny a tax revenue source.
To acquire the finances necessary to fight for our freedoms and preserve our precious pleasure, CRA replies on membership dues and donations (remember we are a non-profit). An additional political benefit to having a member base is the ability to have a larger voice in government. It's amazing what happens when you bring a constituency of thousands (and eventually millions) of members to the table in opposition (or support) of a measure.
THE BOTTOM LINE:
We (everyone taking time to post on this thread – and all other cigar enthusiasts) enjoy cigars. Am I right?
You can either spend your time posting and taking stabs at what needs to be done, or what is not being done...OR you can be part of the solution and become a member of CRA. CRA IS the outlet for allowing your voice to be heard. To me, the nominal $35/year membership fee seems to be well worth the upside potential. Don't you agree?
Let's preserve our freedom to enjoy cigars...PLEASE JOIN CRA TODAY!
Sincerely,
Brian Berman
Director of Membership
Cigar Rights of America
NullSmurf
Das Bruce
- Joined
- Jan 18, 2006
- Messages
- 7,851
The reason for this is not clear to me. Surely you can share the strategic and withhold the tactical.
PhatCat
Member
- Joined
- Sep 19, 2008
- Messages
- 523
Gary. You couldn't be more right, IMHO. A well written post!
CasaSoho
New Englander at Heart
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2006
- Messages
- 982
Brian,
Let me start by thanking you for your reply and extending an invitation to stick around and engage the members of CigarPass. I believe you will find by putting forth a good faith effort to reach out to the members of the community you will add more than a handful of new members to your organization. I would also like to apologize for the way my original post framed this issue. Although the underlying concerns remain genuine, had I known the thread would have led to direct dialogue with CRA I certainly would have chosen words in a more professional manner than the chat room fodder my original post contained.
In regard to the content of your response, I share the same concern as Bruce as it relates to your statement I have placed in bold. The principles residing within me that would not accept this premise from our government also do not allow me to show CRA the type of blind adherence I believe you are asking for. Although I do not plan to monetarily contribute to CRA I do share your mission and suggest the following: As far as I can tell from your web-site, there is no method of entering my contact information to remain apprised of the latest news and calls to action provided in your e-mail updates. This appears to be a member only benefit at this time (please correct me if I am wrong). I would like to extend to you the opportunity to include me among those supporting your cause as you negotiate behind the scenes with our lawmakers and pledge to you that I will act upon anytime called upon in the state of Florida. To accomplish this you need only make a free registration available on cigarrights.org.
I look forward to your continued involvement with the members of this site.
Matt
mmburtch
Sleep deprived and cranky
- Joined
- Oct 11, 2006
- Messages
- 4,879
Thanks for the prompt reply Brian. At least we know you're responsive.
What I know about lobbying comes mostly from reading fiction, which is often fact with the names changed.
As was mentioned above, I hope you choose to participate in this and other cigar communities. Post links to your newsletters, seek new members, etc. Tobacco politics are about the only politics that get beyond a few posts here, if kept civil, they become the exception to the rule.
I know membership is important for the ability to claim X number of votes behind you. The reality is that there are a number of people here and elsewhere in the community who just won't shell out $35, or take the time to register. That doesn't change their dedication to our cause. The same person who can't be bothered to fill out a form and send in $35, might not think twice about calling his senator twice a day for a month in support or opposition to a cause. Keep that person informed.
Matt
What I know about lobbying comes mostly from reading fiction, which is often fact with the names changed.
As was mentioned above, I hope you choose to participate in this and other cigar communities. Post links to your newsletters, seek new members, etc. Tobacco politics are about the only politics that get beyond a few posts here, if kept civil, they become the exception to the rule.
I know membership is important for the ability to claim X number of votes behind you. The reality is that there are a number of people here and elsewhere in the community who just won't shell out $35, or take the time to register. That doesn't change their dedication to our cause. The same person who can't be bothered to fill out a form and send in $35, might not think twice about calling his senator twice a day for a month in support or opposition to a cause. Keep that person informed.
Matt
ironpeddler
Ye Old Newbie
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2008
- Messages
- 6,656
Thank you for your timely response Mr. Berman, unfortunately it wasn't very insightful into what CRA is doing on our behalf.
As Matt so eloquently put it, "The principles residing within me that would not accept this premise from our government also do not allow me to show CRA the type of blind adherence I believe you are asking for." Or as I would more bluntly put it, don't tell me to send you money and not explain what it's being used for.
Your presumption that we are not doing anything to help voice our opinion to our Government by your statement, "You can either spend your time posting and taking stabs at what needs to be done, or what is not being done...OR you can be part of the solution" is very bold. Why would you assume we were just sitting in front of a keyboard complaining? I personally communicated with both of my US Senators (both Democrats) and spoke with one, Senator Frank Lautenberg. I also spoke with one of my State Senators (a cigar smoker) and he said it was "a done deal...save your breathe Gary."
I am not alone in this personal fight, but your request for money is brazen when you're not willing to give any hint of a basic plan or results realized. Every organization touts their effectiveness when they help change the outcome of a political vote...why not you folks? I can't help but think there isn't anything to tout and your clandestine approach in CRA's methodology is almost unbelievable.
Your post accomplished very little other than to reinforce my initial thoughts about CRA.
Gary Roberti
Brick, NJ
lurch
I.Y.A.O.Y.A.S.
- Joined
- Jul 1, 2007
- Messages
- 1,853
He's better with words than I...
Brickhouse
J.C. Newman owes me royalties.
- Joined
- Apr 12, 2006
- Messages
- 10,163
NRA (About us page)
CRA (About us page)
I believe passionately in the goal that both of these organizations work towards....however Mr. Berman, I think you guys could learn a little bit from the NRAs online page.
Your page in short says: Here's who we are and what we believe in. (Which is fine)
Their page in short says: Here's who we are, what we beleive in, and how we work at protecting your freedoms. (Which is great)
See the difference?
No need to point out the size/popularity/funding difference of your two organizations, I understand. I'm simply saying if you added a bit to your "About us" page, it would help your membership grow. Just a little constructive criticism, you being the Membership Director and all.
CRA (About us page)
I believe passionately in the goal that both of these organizations work towards....however Mr. Berman, I think you guys could learn a little bit from the NRAs online page.
Your page in short says: Here's who we are and what we believe in. (Which is fine)
Their page in short says: Here's who we are, what we beleive in, and how we work at protecting your freedoms. (Which is great)
See the difference?
No need to point out the size/popularity/funding difference of your two organizations, I understand. I'm simply saying if you added a bit to your "About us" page, it would help your membership grow. Just a little constructive criticism, you being the Membership Director and all.
Hi Matt,
No need to apologize. I truly appreciate the dialog and thank you for your insights.
To answer your question, CRA does offer a couple FREE programs by which cigar enthusiasts can be kept up-to-date:
1. You can subscribe to the CRA Grassroots Network (sign-up box is on our homepage to the right)
2. You can subscribe to the CRA News RSS feeds which are offered by state
(Note: we're just getting started for April 2009, for extensive archives you can visit www.cigarrights.org/news.htm)
Both of these programs are designed to allow cigar enthusiasts the opportuity to 1) receive weekly emails and calls to action and 2) to see what CRA does before they join with a paid membership.
Thank you again for your dedication to our fight for freedom. We look forward to having you join CRA.
Cheers,
Brian
No need to apologize. I truly appreciate the dialog and thank you for your insights.
To answer your question, CRA does offer a couple FREE programs by which cigar enthusiasts can be kept up-to-date:
1. You can subscribe to the CRA Grassroots Network (sign-up box is on our homepage to the right)
2. You can subscribe to the CRA News RSS feeds which are offered by state
(Note: we're just getting started for April 2009, for extensive archives you can visit www.cigarrights.org/news.htm)
Both of these programs are designed to allow cigar enthusiasts the opportuity to 1) receive weekly emails and calls to action and 2) to see what CRA does before they join with a paid membership.
Thank you again for your dedication to our fight for freedom. We look forward to having you join CRA.
Cheers,
Brian
Please forgive the delay in this response to the discussion regarding CRA, which I've actually enjoyed reading, and been looking forward to posting this reply. First, like anything that touches the political arena, I believe all those that enjoy great cigars should be a part of this process, whether through CRA or their own personal actions. This is truly the "perfect storm" with regard to tobacco issues, at every level of government.
Smoking ban and taxation battles loom across the country, and it will only get worse. It's the reason CRA exists, and the reason the industry came together to form it. From a personal perspective, it's one the largest industries of its kind without a grassroots movement to back it up. We intend to change that. First, "what are we doing?" and why should you join? Let me put this in some perspective.
As I lobbied for the Cigar Association of Virginia before joining CRA, I stated that the cigar industry needed to politically allign themselves with forces greater than themselves. They needed to team up and build coalitions, in order to win on the issues most important to it. That has been the cornerstone of my strategy since joining the organization in December '08. "What are we doing?": I have been meeting with organizations, developing research and executing a new approach to building coalitions for the industry. That includes: Meeting with the National Restaurants Association, American Gaming Association, Licensed Beverage Councils, National Federation of Independent Businesses, and communication with groups such as the US Chamber and related pro-business groups that philosophically ought to be allies of the cigar industry.
Further, I have met with the embassies of Honduras, Nicaragua and the Dominican Republic to address the role of this industry in their national and regional economies. We intend to work with them to convey to Congress that further adverse taxation and regulatory measures from them, will do (more) harm to the Central American economy, and the related supply chain in this nation, all the way to the local community cigar shop.
Without strong support from the retail tobacconist community, it will be far more difficult to have an effective effort for CRA. To that end, we launched the National Tobacconist Program, which has as its centerpiece the Great American Cigar Shop program, which will simultaneously be a political network for cigar retailers, and offer a new marketing venue via the CRA web site for your community cigar shop. It also includes the first ever advisory board for retailers across the country to be engaged in the work of CRA. We have now built an electronic network that has been engaged in tax and smoking ban battles in over a dozen states, while working to link retailer and consumer, to the elected officials in their respective capitol or courthouse, with the same being the case at the federal level.
We launched the creation of the Cigar Rights Political Action Council, as a means for our Ambassador program participants to be more involved in the local political process. There are smoking ban battles in over a dozen states, and OTP tax battles in another dozen. To that end, we are teaming up with groups such as state tavern and bar associations, gaming associations, cigar bars and lounges, and where they accept our position, restaurant associations to fight or work to roll back existing smoking ban statutes. Just today, I was on the phone with the Las Vegas Convention and Visitors Authority on such a bill, and the same with fighting tax legislation in Florida, working to team up with the Florida Chamber of Commerce.
We are gradually building a national network of retailers and consumers that have proven to be quite responsive to our calls to communicate with elected officials on pending legislation. We're also working to form state retailer associations, such as the new effort in North Carolina, and with technical assistance in another half-dozen states, as well. This will allow tobacconists at the state and local level to form their own political action committees, and hence begin more direct involvement at that level. We are connecting them to legal and lobbying representation, and facilitating meetings with concerned parties throughout the country. We are also providing model legislation for exemptions and amendments to existing legislation, that work in the favor of retailer, consumer, and manufacturer.
As for SCHIP and what I read here, it certainly is not true that "they" said to "be happy" with the .40 per cigar. In fact, every person close to this battle was fighting any tax at all, and/or fight for the best possible deal with Congress. Believe me, NO ONE close to this industry is happy with the current SCHIP rate or process, which has only been further complicated by the plethora of state OTP increase proposals. It's (SCHIP) also what helped bring them together for the next fight...and there will be another.
As for Matt and "blind adherence," I wouldn't follow any organization with such "blind adherence" either. But I would work to be involved; to be engaged in the process; and yes - give time and resoures toward the fight to preserve the "right" to enjoy a cigar in those places that also welcome me. Yes, there is power in numbers, and yes, we want to demonstrate a strong political base to get our message across. That is PoliSci 101.
I further believe that one should give to a cause that works to defend something that presents the solitude that enjoying a cigar does for one's life. As another "tangible" in that regard, I would hope that in short order, that CRA can properly capitalize its Political Action Committee so that it can be directly engaged in supporting and defeating candidates for public office based upon their views on "our issues." That will, indeed, come.
Secondly, I want to see CRA create a Legal Defense Fund, to that we can begin engaging some of these smoking ban battles in court. If you follow the CRA web site, in the last 60 days, numerous smoking ban battles have been taken to court, and we should be a part of that process, too. That is not a "brazen" request for money. That's putting dollars to work to defend our ability to enjoy cigars, to help elect politicians that can assist our cause (and defeat them, as well), and building a national network of retailers and consumers, working on concert with the manufacturers, for the good of this cause. Nothing "clandestine" about that. We want to win, Gary. I believe that's explaining, in part, what funds would be used for. But there's more.
Yes, we're throwing some parties, participating in Big Smokes, giving away some tee shirts and working on some "fun" events for members. That's just good outreach; good marketing; and membership development. There will be dinners, cigar events with manufacturers, and opportunities to promote the issues close to us, while having a cocktail and cigar. Further, for that $35, CRA members are about to have the opportunity to have (less transportation) expense covered trips to the Latin American countries producing those cigars. Through our new State Cigar Rights Clubs, and a national drawing, we will be giving away over a dozen trips to Honduras, Nicaragua, Bahamas and the Dominican Republic, so that members can see first hand, what goes into making those cigars you enjoy. Further, we're about to roll out the first "members only" cigars, where our member manufacturers are blending cigars just for CRA and its members. Sorry, you have to be a member to get them. It also has its privilages.
We will be adding a section to the web site soon on how you, personally, can be engaged in the process on the issues closest to us. It will be a section dedicated to the "how we work," to some degree. One thing is for sure, though, in short order we hope to galvanize cigar smokers across the country that are tired of nanny government dictating where we can enjoy a cigar, and tired of targeted taxation that can destroy an economic staple of this hemisphere's economy. We can change some elections, and we will. Just ask "former" state senator Brandon Bell of Virginia, and I would be glad to send you the story of how one local cigar shop changed an election. That's money well spent - creating a "former" state senator and the godfather of smoking ban legislation in Virginia.
We will keep this forum posted on our efforts, and we hope that you will be a part of that process....It's going to be exciting.
J. Glynn Loope, Executive Director
Cigar Rights of America
Smoking ban and taxation battles loom across the country, and it will only get worse. It's the reason CRA exists, and the reason the industry came together to form it. From a personal perspective, it's one the largest industries of its kind without a grassroots movement to back it up. We intend to change that. First, "what are we doing?" and why should you join? Let me put this in some perspective.
As I lobbied for the Cigar Association of Virginia before joining CRA, I stated that the cigar industry needed to politically allign themselves with forces greater than themselves. They needed to team up and build coalitions, in order to win on the issues most important to it. That has been the cornerstone of my strategy since joining the organization in December '08. "What are we doing?": I have been meeting with organizations, developing research and executing a new approach to building coalitions for the industry. That includes: Meeting with the National Restaurants Association, American Gaming Association, Licensed Beverage Councils, National Federation of Independent Businesses, and communication with groups such as the US Chamber and related pro-business groups that philosophically ought to be allies of the cigar industry.
Further, I have met with the embassies of Honduras, Nicaragua and the Dominican Republic to address the role of this industry in their national and regional economies. We intend to work with them to convey to Congress that further adverse taxation and regulatory measures from them, will do (more) harm to the Central American economy, and the related supply chain in this nation, all the way to the local community cigar shop.
Without strong support from the retail tobacconist community, it will be far more difficult to have an effective effort for CRA. To that end, we launched the National Tobacconist Program, which has as its centerpiece the Great American Cigar Shop program, which will simultaneously be a political network for cigar retailers, and offer a new marketing venue via the CRA web site for your community cigar shop. It also includes the first ever advisory board for retailers across the country to be engaged in the work of CRA. We have now built an electronic network that has been engaged in tax and smoking ban battles in over a dozen states, while working to link retailer and consumer, to the elected officials in their respective capitol or courthouse, with the same being the case at the federal level.
We launched the creation of the Cigar Rights Political Action Council, as a means for our Ambassador program participants to be more involved in the local political process. There are smoking ban battles in over a dozen states, and OTP tax battles in another dozen. To that end, we are teaming up with groups such as state tavern and bar associations, gaming associations, cigar bars and lounges, and where they accept our position, restaurant associations to fight or work to roll back existing smoking ban statutes. Just today, I was on the phone with the Las Vegas Convention and Visitors Authority on such a bill, and the same with fighting tax legislation in Florida, working to team up with the Florida Chamber of Commerce.
We are gradually building a national network of retailers and consumers that have proven to be quite responsive to our calls to communicate with elected officials on pending legislation. We're also working to form state retailer associations, such as the new effort in North Carolina, and with technical assistance in another half-dozen states, as well. This will allow tobacconists at the state and local level to form their own political action committees, and hence begin more direct involvement at that level. We are connecting them to legal and lobbying representation, and facilitating meetings with concerned parties throughout the country. We are also providing model legislation for exemptions and amendments to existing legislation, that work in the favor of retailer, consumer, and manufacturer.
As for SCHIP and what I read here, it certainly is not true that "they" said to "be happy" with the .40 per cigar. In fact, every person close to this battle was fighting any tax at all, and/or fight for the best possible deal with Congress. Believe me, NO ONE close to this industry is happy with the current SCHIP rate or process, which has only been further complicated by the plethora of state OTP increase proposals. It's (SCHIP) also what helped bring them together for the next fight...and there will be another.
As for Matt and "blind adherence," I wouldn't follow any organization with such "blind adherence" either. But I would work to be involved; to be engaged in the process; and yes - give time and resoures toward the fight to preserve the "right" to enjoy a cigar in those places that also welcome me. Yes, there is power in numbers, and yes, we want to demonstrate a strong political base to get our message across. That is PoliSci 101.
I further believe that one should give to a cause that works to defend something that presents the solitude that enjoying a cigar does for one's life. As another "tangible" in that regard, I would hope that in short order, that CRA can properly capitalize its Political Action Committee so that it can be directly engaged in supporting and defeating candidates for public office based upon their views on "our issues." That will, indeed, come.
Secondly, I want to see CRA create a Legal Defense Fund, to that we can begin engaging some of these smoking ban battles in court. If you follow the CRA web site, in the last 60 days, numerous smoking ban battles have been taken to court, and we should be a part of that process, too. That is not a "brazen" request for money. That's putting dollars to work to defend our ability to enjoy cigars, to help elect politicians that can assist our cause (and defeat them, as well), and building a national network of retailers and consumers, working on concert with the manufacturers, for the good of this cause. Nothing "clandestine" about that. We want to win, Gary. I believe that's explaining, in part, what funds would be used for. But there's more.
Yes, we're throwing some parties, participating in Big Smokes, giving away some tee shirts and working on some "fun" events for members. That's just good outreach; good marketing; and membership development. There will be dinners, cigar events with manufacturers, and opportunities to promote the issues close to us, while having a cocktail and cigar. Further, for that $35, CRA members are about to have the opportunity to have (less transportation) expense covered trips to the Latin American countries producing those cigars. Through our new State Cigar Rights Clubs, and a national drawing, we will be giving away over a dozen trips to Honduras, Nicaragua, Bahamas and the Dominican Republic, so that members can see first hand, what goes into making those cigars you enjoy. Further, we're about to roll out the first "members only" cigars, where our member manufacturers are blending cigars just for CRA and its members. Sorry, you have to be a member to get them. It also has its privilages.
We will be adding a section to the web site soon on how you, personally, can be engaged in the process on the issues closest to us. It will be a section dedicated to the "how we work," to some degree. One thing is for sure, though, in short order we hope to galvanize cigar smokers across the country that are tired of nanny government dictating where we can enjoy a cigar, and tired of targeted taxation that can destroy an economic staple of this hemisphere's economy. We can change some elections, and we will. Just ask "former" state senator Brandon Bell of Virginia, and I would be glad to send you the story of how one local cigar shop changed an election. That's money well spent - creating a "former" state senator and the godfather of smoking ban legislation in Virginia.
We will keep this forum posted on our efforts, and we hope that you will be a part of that process....It's going to be exciting.
J. Glynn Loope, Executive Director
Cigar Rights of America
mmburtch
Sleep deprived and cranky
- Joined
- Oct 11, 2006
- Messages
- 4,879
Thanks for the kind words, and I hope this clarified some of the concerns raised. We realize that this type of information needs to get out through these types of forums on a regular basis. Right now, though, the brush fires are popping up everywhere (Texas, Nevada, and Florida today), but we pledge to provide regular updates through this and related venues, as well as the CRA web site. Keep the faith, and remember the sage words of former US Senator Barry Goldwater...."A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take everything you have."
J. Glynn Loope, Executive Director
Cigar Rights of America
J. Glynn Loope, Executive Director
Cigar Rights of America
mjolnir01
El Cañón de Latón
- Joined
- Jun 1, 2008
- Messages
- 2,658
Mr. Loope,
Thank you for the clarification. I think you've finally sold a very large number of cigar smokers on the merits of the CRA. I will proudly join in the very near future as well.
Very respectfully,
Barry Rudd
Many thanks, Barry....and we look forward to having you and each contributor to this forum as a member. Honestly, we want to "earn" your membership. I hope that some of the initiatives we outlined was a step forward in that direction.
Glynn
J. Glynn Loope, Executive Director
Cigar Rights of America
Glynn
J. Glynn Loope, Executive Director
Cigar Rights of America
Brickhouse
J.C. Newman owes me royalties.
- Joined
- Apr 12, 2006
- Messages
- 10,163
Mr. Loope, this is exactly what I was looking for in a response from CRA.
I'll be joining shortly. Easy decision after reading your posts.
Thanks
I'll be joining shortly. Easy decision after reading your posts.
Thanks