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First SCHIP casualty?

This really breaks my heart. Those families will be in my thoughts.
 
Classic example of taxing people out of their jobs. It's a tough time to be unemployed right now. Prayers sent for the workers out there. At least they will be paid through August.
 
We haven't seen anything yet. There is much more pain to come...

:(
 
My heart goes out to those workers and their families, but it seems a bit early to be blaming SCHIP, as problematical and misguided a piece of legislation as it is, almost before it's even gone into effect.

These are hard times for American manufacturing all across the board. Bass shoes, Levi jeans . . . many a classic American brand has gone overseas.

~Boar
 
Not A Nice Person said:
My heart goes out to those workers and their families, but it seems a bit early to be blaming SCHIP, as problematical and misguided a piece of legislation as it is, almost before it's even gone into effect.
Click to expand...

The bill was signed into law on 2/4/09 and I'm pretty sure it's already in place.
 
Has it occured to anyone that the reason that they're folding isn't SCHIP, or anti-smoking legislation, but that it's a lousy procuct.

Doc.
 
Not A Nice Person said:
My heart goes out to those workers and their families, but it seems a bit early to be blaming SCHIP, as problematical and misguided a piece of legislation as it is, almost before it's even gone into effect.

These are hard times for American manufacturing all across the board. Bass shoes, Levi jeans . . . many a classic American brand has gone overseas.

~Boar
Click to expand...


My thinking exactly. For a factory that's been in operation for over a hundred years, I find it impossible to believe that a cigar tax that actually took effect less than 90 days ago brought this place to it's knees. No one is talking about all the price increases these mfg's have sneaked in under the guise of the SCHIP Tax, or the companies that started charging half of the increase several months prior to April 1 because they 'didn't want the consumer to be burdened with the full increase all at one time'. All they did was pocket any money that was made in advance of the tax taking effect. If you're going to talk about it, let's not just blow smoke. (No pun intended.................... ok yes it was. :sign: )

Besides, maybe they should stop mfg. crap.
 
That snowball is just starting down the hill. This article should be sent to every politician in Washington D.C. - Simple economics - I guess they all missed that day in school.
 
amateuraficionado said:
Besides, maybe they should stop mfg. crap.
Click to expand...

That thought occurred to me, too. Hav-A-Tampa? Maybe it's different in other parts of the country, or in bigger cities, but I can't remember the last time I saw anyone smoking one of those . . . I've got friends that take a few packs of Black 'n Milds up to their deer camps, but other than that, everyone I know that smokes, smokes either handrolled cigars, or cigarettes.

They should've just gotten on the flavors and blunts train with White Owl. Altadis scapegoating their poor marketing on a bad tax seems a bit self-serving to me.

~Boar
 
Not A Nice Person said:
amateuraficionado said:
Besides, maybe they should stop mfg. crap.
Click to expand...

That thought occurred to me, too. Hav-A-Tampa? Maybe it's different in other parts of the country, or in bigger cities, but I can't remember the last time I saw anyone smoking one of those . . . I've got friends that take a few packs of Black 'n Milds up to their deer camps, but other than that, everyone I know that smokes, smokes either handrolled cigars, or cigarettes.

They should've just gotten on the flavors and blunts train with White Owl. Altadis scapegoating their poor marketing on a bad tax seems a bit self-serving to me.

~Boar
Click to expand...
Hav-A-Tampas used to be popular with the woodchucks and loggers in these parts, but no more. Most smoke Black 'n Milds now. Better at keeping the black flies away.

Doc.
 
Devil Doc said:
Has it occured to anyone that the reason that they're folding isn't SCHIP, or anti-smoking legislation, but that it's a lousy procuct.

Doc.
Click to expand...

It may be a lousy product in the minds of those of us here who know what a good smoke is but for a person of limited means who wants to smoke a cigar, Hav-A-Tampas are a staple at $0.50 (or less) a piece.
 
Think about it....if a product you use goes up 30% overnight...how long will you keep buying it?

I think the main thing that's missed is...they will still product the cigar overseas.

Once again....American jobs moving over seas due to taxation. (and I'm sure other causes)

Now, the tax will be in play still...but the cost reduction offsets the sales slide. In theory.

In the mean time, we know have more folks that 'may' need support in the short to long run.


<edit to add...and we havn't even seen that the new regulation of tobacco will do!>
 
grateful1 said:
Think about it....if a product you use goes up 30% overnight...how long will you keep buying it?

I think the main thing that's missed is...they will still product the cigar overseas.

Once again....American jobs moving over seas due to taxation. (and I'm sure other causes)

Now, the tax will be in play still...but the cost reduction offsets the sales slide. In theory.

In the mean time, we know have more folks that 'may' need support in the short to long run.


<edit to add...and we havn't even seen that the new regulation of tobacco will do!>
Click to expand...

As far as I understand SCHIP, the tax applies to both domestic and imported cigars all the same. Is that not correct?

If that is the case, then how would this tax cause them to move overseas if they are still having to pay it when they import the cigars they make in the other country? Sure, you decrease your cost overall, but you are still paying the tax. The blame in this case for the loss of jobs would seem to fall on outsourcing, not the SCHIP tax; but, I can see how it would be a conveinent target for the manufacturers.
 
Mike33 said:
grateful1 said:
Think about it....if a product you use goes up 30% overnight...how long will you keep buying it?

I think the main thing that's missed is...they will still product the cigar overseas.

Once again....American jobs moving over seas due to taxation. (and I'm sure other causes)

Now, the tax will be in play still...but the cost reduction offsets the sales slide. In theory.

In the mean time, we know have more folks that 'may' need support in the short to long run.


<edit to add...and we havn't even seen that the new regulation of tobacco will do!>
Click to expand...

As far as I understand SCHIP, the tax applies to both domestic and imported cigars all the same. Is that not correct?

If that is the case, then how would this tax cause them to move overseas if they are still having to pay it when they import the cigars they make in the other country? Sure, you decrease your cost overall, but you are still paying the tax. The blame in this case for the loss of jobs would seem to fall on outsourcing, not the SCHIP tax; but, I can see how it would be a conveinent target for the manufacturers.
Click to expand...


That's what I said.

The tax just put some of the companies over the edge.

Now...Read more, post less!

:sign:
 
Sorry guys but SCHIP isn't to blame, Florida passed a $1 per stick tax on cigars.
 
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