Which one of these is not like the other one?

[Ginseng]

Now for the second part of our little game here; I took apart each cigar after smoking them for a bit. Can you figure out which filler goes with which cigar?

Filler A

Filler B

What do you think?

[snapback]243791[/snapback]​

Ooooh,

That's ugly.

So, did you repack the real one and smoke it?

Wilkey

BTW, great post. Pleae do some more.

 

[cvmfour]

Good post Andrew :thumbs: I think this was just a by-product of something and he wanted to get down to the truth. Hopefully no more fake Cohibas will come Moki's way *cough* vitasea *cough* :laugh:

 

[moki]

Good post Andrew :thumbs: I think this was just a by-product of something and he wanted to get down to the truth.

[snapback]243874[/snapback]​

Yep... exactly so.

 

[indyrob]

WOW, a mixed filler Cohiba. I asked for that last x-mas!

 

[Strayvector]

Moki, when was the Reserva released? I thought it was in 2002, but I must be wrong since the band on your stick has the new bands that first came into use in 2003.

 

[cvmfour]

They were released in 2002 and re-released in 2003

 

[OpusX_steve]

nice post

 

[SeanGAR]

Great post Moki .. thanks!

Do you know if all handmade Cubans are entubar rolled (the accordian style)? I've seen that type of rolling in a LGCR5 that I dissected last year.

 

[Lkyman]

Great post Moki. Always looking to learn more.

Thanks

Scott

 

[moki]

Great post Moki .. thanks!

Do you know if all handmade Cubans are entubar rolled (the accordian style)? I've seen that type of rolling in a LGCR5 that I dissected last year.

[snapback]243918[/snapback]​

Well, entubar is different, instead of accordion-style book folding, the individual leaves are literally rolled into tubes. All Fuentes are rolled entubar.

 

[SeanGAR]

Great post Moki .. thanks!

Do you know if all handmade Cubans are entubar rolled (the accordian style)?  I've seen that type of rolling in a LGCR5 that I dissected last year.

[snapback]243918[/snapback]​

Well, entubar is different, instead of accordion-style book folding, the individual leaves are literally rolled into tubes. All Fuentes are rolled entubar.

[snapback]243960[/snapback]​

Thanks Moki, that would certainly explain the "tubar" in "entubar" (and explain why Fuentes draw so well), but I've read definitions that made me think the accordian style was (also) called entubar. Do you know of any definition that would specifically describe the accordian folded rolling?

Entubar - A rolling method that originated in Cuba. Rather than booking the filler leaves, the roller folds each individual filler leaf back on itself, then bunches the leaves together. Proponents of this method say it creates superior air flow through the cigar, which results in a more even draw and burn. From http://aficionadocigar.com/cigar101/glossary.htm and a few other places with same definition. http://www.cigarsinternational.com/html/cig101_23crp.asp

 

[moki]

here and also here you can see entubar rolling, the leaves are actually rolled up individually in tubes, then bunched together. The accordion-style method is what it sounds like, the leaf is folded over itself.

 

[SeanGAR]

Thanks Moki.

 

[Ironworker]

Know your vendor and none of this matters. There are tons of discrepancies with any product from Cuba.

That saying, the one cigar on the right is way too long, if the cigar on the left is the right length.

Bands, rows of dots, coloration means jack S--t. Know your vendor.

[snapback]243712[/snapback]​

I couldn't disagree more. While there may be discrepancies with Cuban products I don't belive there is with the embossing of bands, fonts, colors and other distinctive character traits that Cohiba or other MFG uses on their products.

Nobody knows a vendor when they use them for the first time. Sometimes your usual vendor may not have the smokes your looking for or you try a new vendor because someone recommended them to you.

It's this type of post that makes us all more aware of what these scam artist are using and their latest techniques.

How do you know your vendor? Have you ever went to your vendors shop, place of business? NO, so unless a vendor is in my country and I could physically drive to his place of business I still buy with caution. I trust no one.
Bands,Rows of dots and coloration mean everything to me. Its all I have.

Rich

 

[moki]

Know your vendor and none of this matters. There are tons of discrepancies with any product from cuba.

That saying, the one cigar on the right is way too long, if the cigar on the left is the right legnth.

Bands, rows of dots, coloration means jack S--t. Know your vendor.

[snapback]243712[/snapback]​

I disagree. I've heard horror stories of vendors that started off legit, then gradually introduced fake product into the pipeline (knowingly or unknowingly). Certainly part of the equation is knowing your sources; the other part of the equation is being an educated consumer, and looking at highly counterfeited product with a skeptical eye when you receive it.

Certainly lots of odd stuff comes out of Cuba, but that doesn't mean there aren't things you can look for on the bands, cigars, packaging, and presentation.

I will say that given the choice between the two, I'd rather have a trusted source than empirical knowledge (because there are indeed plenty of irregulatities/screw-ups from Cuba)... but why not have both?

 

[Ginseng]

Know your vendor and none of this matters. There are tons of discrepancies with any product from Cuba.

That saying, the one cigar on the right is way too long, if the cigar on the left is the right length.

Bands, rows of dots, coloration means jack S--t. Know your vendor.

[snapback]243712[/snapback]​

I couldn't disagree more. While there may be discrepancies with Cuban products I don't belive there is with the embossing of bands, fonts, colors and other distinctive character traits that Cohiba or other MFG uses on their products.

Nobody knows a vendor when they use them for the first time. Sometimes your usual vendor may not have the smokes your looking for or you try a new vendor because someone recommended them to you.

It's this type of post that makes us all more aware of what these scam artist are using and their latest techniques.

How do you know your vendor? Have you ever went to your vendors shop, place of business? NO, so unless a vendor is in my country and I could physically drive to his place of business I still buy with caution. I trust no one.
Bands,Rows of dots and coloration mean everything to me. Its all I have.

Rich

[snapback]244287[/snapback]​

Right on, and to the heart of the matter. Well said, Iron. Where there is no definitive verification, there cannot be any genuine trust. Only practical trust that let's us get on with it and get what we want.

Wilkey

 

[LouieD]

Great post!!! Last year when I got serious about cigars, a "friend" generously offered me a dozen of his "Cuban Cohibas" that he had just got from a "trusted source". Through the generosity of the BOTLS on CP, I have had the pleasure of experiencing several real Cohibas. I also did comparisons of labels and some of the differences were the same as Moki's, particularly the letters in COHIBA were not the same shape. Posts like this one from the FOGS make CP the best cigar forum on the web! I still have a few of the fakes left. I am going to cut one open and take a look.

 

[ML237]

Fantastic post Moki!!! Thanks a bunch for educating & so empirically showing the various differences we are faced with deling with the counterfits. Besides the wrapper & band differences I really enjoyed the full CSI-like autopsy followed up with close-up photography. The lesson was much appreciated.

 

[connoiseur29]

I have done my share of cigar autopsies and they are quite revealing don't you all think? Seek out the truth and you will find it. It keeps everyone honest.
One note, if you're going to perform an autopsy, be meticulous and if you are suspect of a box and you just have to see, don't just pick at random. The suspect ones are frequently mixed in with legit ones. Pick out the one that just doesn't look right and your autopsy will probably confirm your suspicion.

 

[Zeebra]

Why would someone producing fake Cohiba bands make such an obvious error like the 2 rows of boxes instead of 3? Given that fake money is sometimes so difficult to tell apart from real money, I wonder why counterfeiters don't pay more attention to detail when doing stuff like this?