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I'm shopping for a gun

I think you should quit screwing around and get a couple of H&K MP5SD's. You could shoot a bad guy(s) in the face ten times and a guy standing next to them might not hear it. If he did hear it, he'd probably think you were shooting at him with a pneumatic nail gun. Fix it up with an infrared laser and a night vision scope, and you've got a low recoil, tactical, easy to fire, reliable as hell weapon that will do in a pinch for close area denial in the home.

Of course this would be "a bit" more than the $600.00 budget and won't conceal like a teeny little gun, but dang...... :laugh:
 
BlindedByScience said:
I think you should quit screwing around and get a couple of H&K MP5SD's. You could shoot a bad guy(s) in the face ten times and a guy standing next to them might not hear it. If he did hear it, he'd probably think you were shooting at him with a pneumatic nail gun. Fix it up with an infrared laser and a night vision scope, and you've got a low recoil, tactical, easy to fire, reliable as hell weapon that will do in a pinch for close area denial in the home.

Of course this would be "a bit" more than the $600.00 budget and won't conceal like a teeny little gun, but dang...... :laugh:
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Yah, a little over budget. Besides, the supressor would attract unwanted attention from ATF.
 
NullSmurf said:
Yah, a little over budget. Besides, the supressor would attract unwanted attention from ATF.
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....actually, I think CO is a "title three" state, which means it's legal, it just costs more and requires paperwork.... :cool:
 
I made my move. Taurus P111 like this one.
111SSP.jpg


The Tanner Gun Show was in town this weekend. Lines just to enter were several hundred yards long. So, I went to Bass Pro where I found this one in the fine gun room, discounted. I grabbed the last two boxes of hollow points off the shelf - no ball ammo at all. Next, the conceal/carry course for my permit.
 
NullSmurf said:
I do not currently own a gun. Wife and I have agreed that personal protection is an issue. I will not hesitate to take the life of someone who is a threat to me or my family. Wife will also do what it takes. My experience in the service was extensive, but of limited use in this case. I have my orders, so here are my goals:

1. Personal protection in the home.
2. Portable and easy to load and fire
3. One shot, target goes down.
4. ~$600
5. Bling is not an issue, but I do NOT want an ugly gun.
6. Not intended for concealed carry...yet.


What advice do you have?
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Bruce:

Your request for advice from experts may disqualify me but what the heck.

I can't stress strongly enough the importance of the gun being idiot proof! If you or the Mrs. ever really need to use it you are likely to be scared to death, shaking like a leaf, and your mind won't seem to work. A double action revolver is the only gun that I would use in this situation, no latches, releases, catches, safeties, no instructions to remember, etc.....just point and shoot. As far as the "one shot, target goes down" that is 100% dependent on where you hit them and while a scatter gun improves your odds of hitting them, if the load isn't concentrated in a vital area it doesn't matter......and a scatter gun is hard to wield in a situation where milliseconds could count. A scatter gun is also hard to hide if you need to be in stealth mode ;)

I used to load my six shooter with two "shot" loads then four bullets in case I ever needed to scare someone without killing them.



Breedy said:
AngryFishH said:
Doesn't a .380 and a .22 rimfire have almost the same muzzle velocity out of a handgun? Plus, you would have to get real up close and personal.

The effective range on a small .380 is like 10-15 feet. That's WAY too close if you ask me, especially if you have to shoot the perp in the eye because the round has no real stopping power.

Fish
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In all fairness I agree with the .380 being on the low end of adaquate as far as stopping power goes. I haven't read all the post, however, most engagements with a mope will occur in that 10-15 foot range. If you are farther away a distinct arguement for fleeing could and should be made. As far as shoting them in the eye goes, its a nice thought, but not really a reality. The end goal of any defensive measure should be to end the confrontation, be it with a mope's death or disabling him a enough to get away.

Also, from personal experience, I have seen more shooting deaths involving small caliber hand guns to the groin and stomach area than I have large caliber to the chest and head. I will grant that this is probable because the "peeps" perfer the cheap small caliber guns, but thats just my two cents.
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The .380 stands for "spins the perp 380 degrees (right back at you) and just pisses him off"
 
I neglected to add that this one is 9mm. I think that'll do. My only complaint after reading all the reviews is that it's not simple to tear down. It also requires a security torx (included). Why would they make this difficult?
 
A little late to the party here, I would have recomended (especially for the wife) a Ruger SP101 and load it with .38 special +P rounds. Recoil is much much better compared the personal defense loads of the .357 and the gun lends itself very well for concealment.

Above all else, the most important thing is PRACTICE. Practice Practice Practice.

Good luck and I hope you never have to use it.
 
Just my .02 worth ...as an expert....on the weapons and tactics of CQB (not to mention some practical application!) you need to look up the laws of Imminent domain in your state. Than ask why you want a weapon for home defense, what you have is not as important as why you need it and the conditions you will use it IMHO.

You already have some great info in this thread!
 
I was going to add in another plug for the SP101 also. I bought this recently and it will be my daily carry gun, as I'm getting my permit this month.

Shaved hammer, and crimson trace laser grips. Hold it, put the red dot on what you want to shoot, and squeeze. its that simple.

I Almost bought a Millinneum PT145 recently, but I've just heard so many iffy things about taurus semi's. Well, I haven't even heard THAT many....but a defense gun isn't something I want to have to hear 1 out of 5 people giving negative reviews about....especially when most of those negative reviews invlve taking advantage of the lifetime warranty...

If you're still in the market for another pistol, check out the sp101 that others reccomended.

my baby...
ruger2.jpg
 
Dr. Marneaus said:
Hold it, put the red dot on what you want to shoot, and squeeze. its that simple.
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Yes and no. Trigger pull and proper technique still make or break your shot. I have a laser / light on my defense gun, but plan for that nice red dot to not function when you need it most. No dis on Crimson Trace (they make good stuff) but you should be very capable without the laser. Practice, practice, practice some more, etc.

Bruce - a worthy choice. Primary concern for a defense weapon is reliability. Don't get too sure of your new tool until you get 4-500 rounds through it....at least. And, get some real storage. Good small quick access safes that can be lag bolted down can be had all day for less than $100.00. Don't mess around - get one.

You can thank the liability lawyers for the torx requirement. I'm very sure it's part of the gun "lock" and it's a pain in the butt. My newly acquired carry is the S&W 642 snub gun. Turns out it has a "zit" on the side that locks up the action if desired. Hopefully not when not desired; might require a little "work" inside..... :whistling:

Good luck with the new tool - B.B.S.

Edited - I'll get the "to, too, and two" thing down someday.........
 
BlindedByScience said:
Dr. Marneaus said:
Hold it, put the red dot on what you want to shoot, and squeeze. its that simple.
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Yes and no. Trigger pull and proper technique still make or break your shot. I have a laser / light on my defense gun, but plan for that nice red dot to not function when you need it most. No dis on Crimson Trace (they make good stuff) but you should be very capable without the laser. Practice, practice, practice some more, etc.
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I agree with you 100%, sorry if I seem to have over simplified it.

I don't use the laser while shooting the pistol, target shooting, etc. I do, however, leave it on when it sits in the night stand. It's never my plan to rely on the laser, or base my shooting practices/skills on the availability of the laser. However, I do like knowing that it's there for any situation where instant target acquisition would be necessary, if I could bring the gun up to my eye level, I'd still know exactly where it was pointed.

You brought up a good point that I should have mentioned.
 
I read through this a bit but didn't find any reference to whether or not you had children in the house. The only reason I ask is basically whether overpenetration is an issue. i.e. if someone dodges left and you shoot them at an unintended angle could it go through a wall towards a child. Or are you alone and basically as long as your wife's behind you, you're free to shoot in any direction without risk?

I would still vote heavily for the shotgun. Although it seems you've been moving towards handgun. For a couple of reasons, one is the longer barrel seems easier to mentally control when tired. Handgun discipline in the middle of the night and startled is very difficult. I've never shot at a moving target in close quarters but I imagine it's even more difficult.

I *think* the barrel length of a shotgun naturally reinforces a groggy mind into better aim direction. Just opinion there. Using a bigger gauge with a shorter stock will make it easy to swing and using really small pellets will probably blind the guy, plus the lesser recoil might make it easier to keep on target. And I'd also suggest using a semi-auto shotgun, you can lock the action open and replace springs yearly and still get the "ca chuck" when you release the slide. Pumping is going to disrupt your aim when tired.

Again, that's just one guy's two cents and there's some great advice in here already.
 
NullSmurf said:
Ammo is a bit hard to come by. :(
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Sorry, Bruce; you don't get a pass on this one. Save your HP's for defense and look for some hardball for practice.

Hardball can be had....just takes some looking.

PM if you really can't find any......B.B.S.
 
Glad this thread popped up. I just recently applied for my FOID here in Illinois and was in the market for a handgun. Some interesting points raised in this thread and some interesting choices about different guns I did not consider. I plan on making a trip to the range monthly. As stated in this thread It is important to feel comfortable using a firearm. And most importantly education and practice.

What are your thought on the the Ruger P90 , XD 45 ACP. I have had the chance to fire both weapons and they both felt perfect for my hand size. In your honest opinion which is the best of the 2. Or if you can recommend alternatives which I could try.



Thanks
 
Bruce, you have some great advise in this thread, not much I can ad really.

For what it's worth here is a site which does tests on penetration.
 
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