CP's "Cigar 101" Newbie Pass 4

[Q_The_Cop]

Oh Oh Greg I meant to ask is there a host bag in there as well? I had read a few other passes and there was one in those. If not I think there should be cause you're doing a bang up job so far, with us newbs, and it hasn't even been sent. :laugh: Who's with me!!

 

[Breedy]

Good discussion so far. I would just add that for the most part the MSRP of Padron's, Fuentes, and Tat can all be found here on CP. Most of the pass that I have watched in my time here have used MMM guide for pricing on these. The reason is the semi-rare nature makes only line pricing spotty at best.

No.2................5.500 x 52............$15.99 / $383.76 (24)

MMM Padron Pricing Guide


The question was also raised about the Ashton Vintage vs. Ashton Cabinet. This is one of the times that I wished I had saved some of my old CI catalogs, I seem to recall that the Cabinet had Vintage on the band or visa a versa, but that they were in fact the same cigar. I could be wrong, but it seems to stick out in my mind.

Just a quick word on Gurkha's as well. Marketing Juggernaut, not quite up to Drew Estate standards, but still pretty impressive. Huge retail mark up, then show drastic discount and the consumer is left thinking they got a bargin. This might not be popular, but Gurkha's, the Beast and Titan in particular, are fairly decent cigars IMO. That being said are they worth $20 Dollars? Some might think so, but as someone pointed out they can be found regular at deep discounts through various sources.

I would say that if Andy wanted the Padron 1926 No.2 a good put would be an Opus. I am drawing on the fact that Andy would seem to love Opus, (that is a pretty big jar of bands ) and the semi-rare nature of both cigars. I would grant that Opus would seem to be harder to find, but three times a year they show up at my local and I buy my Padron's here, so to me its a wash.

As far as "overputs", the mantra is "equal takes for equal puts". You can discuss the fact that we are all grown men with free will till the cows come home, it doesn't change the fact that on page one of most every pass I have seen, those words are in BOLD . Yet this issue comes up time and time again. If you can't keep it close move on. Thats not meant to be a shot at anyone, just a simple nugget of advice.

Just some thoughts, good luck guys. Let me know you anyone needs anymore help.

Brandon

 

[insight]

Reading through this discussion here are my thoughts...IMO you should never be involving the highest price in your average for a pass. This isn't a floating average game. If I can buy a box of stick X for $100 without it being on some absurd sale or multi-box discount etc. that seems like the price to use. If CI is charging $5 a stick for a graycliff whatever and you use cigar.com pricing of 345346523 per stick in your averaging as well you are going to artificially inflate the trading value of said graycliff. Thats nonsense. If you paid too much for a cigar that is unfortunate but it should never be parlayed onto the pass as overhead. The same is true of takes obviously. If I paid $30 for an Opus Robusto it isn't your problem, it is still an $11 cigar. Establishing value for production sticks that are not particularly rare need not be this difficult.

 

[CigarMan Andy]

Good discussion so far. I would just add that for the most part the MSRP of Padron's, Fuentes, and Tat can all be found here on CP. Most of the pass that I have watched in my time here have used MMM guide for pricing on these. The reason is the semi-rare nature makes only line pricing spotty at best.

No.2................5.500 x 52............$15.99 / $383.76 (24)

MMM Padron Pricing Guide


The question was also raised about the Ashton Vintage vs. Ashton Cabinet. This is one of the times that I wished I had saved some of my old CI catalogs, I seem to recall that the Cabinet had Vintage on the band or visa a versa, but that they were in fact the same cigar. I could be wrong, but it seems to stick out in my mind.

Just a quick word on Gurkha's as well. Marketing Juggernaut, not quite up to Drew Estate standards, but still pretty impressive. Huge retail mark up, then show drastic discount and the consumer is left thinking they got a bargin. This might not be popular, but Gurkha's, the Beast and Titan in particular, are fairly decent cigars IMO. That being said are they worth $20 Dollars? Some might think so, but as someone pointed out they can be found regular at deep discounts through various sources.

I would say that if Andy wanted the Padron 1926 No.2 a good put would be an Opus. I am drawing on the fact that Andy would seem to love Opus, (that is a pretty big jar of bands ) and the semi-rare nature of both cigars. I would grant that Opus would seem to be harder to find, but three times a year they show up at my local and I buy my Padron's here, so to me its a wash.

As far as "overputs", the mantra is "equal takes for equal puts". You can discuss the fact that we are all grown men with free will till the cows come home, it doesn't change the fact that on page one of most every pass I have seen, those words are in BOLD . Yet this issue comes up time and time again. If you can't keep it close move on. Thats not meant to be a shot at anyone, just a simple nugget of advice.

Just some thoughts, good luck guys. Let me know you anyone needs anymore help.

Brandon

Ah Breedy. You know me well. Which Opus would you like me to put. I have DC, Perfecxion #2, #4 or X, PR xXx or SB. Love ya Brandon. Your choice would be? Perfecxion #2 is the closest at $15.96 MSRP or DC at $16.90. but with rarity being a factor?

Andy

 

[SPIVY]

If you are putting in an opus I think that the super beli or fuente fuente is closest rarity+msrp i.e. Padron More MSRP Less Rarity

 

[Kingantz]

Whew, we haven't even got the pass on the road and look at all the good stuff going! Andy, sorry you're getting to be the "guinea pig" up front. Fun though, right? :blush:

Lots of good discussion and information being passed around here. Insight is correct that this doesn't need to be too complicated, although we do want to learn, me as much as the next person. For the intents and purposes of this pass, we will use Cigarcyclopedia to determine pricing as long as there are enough box prices listed. If there's not enough listed, check out a few sites to get prices. Cigarcyclopedia lists the lowest prices at each vendor, so that's what we will use if looking at different sites.

Does this make sense to everyone?

 

[Golfanatic]

It makes sense to me capt...I mean professor Greg!

 

[wavescrashing]

Greg, I love the info shared on these passes. The link to cigarcyclopedia I saw on another Pass thread a while back made me realize how much cheaper CI is to most other sites referenced on there. It makes my pockets lighter though
Thanks again for the opportunity and the info.

 

[mrrt]

So are we also tossing out the highest price when determining price..>>?? I didnt see a definite yes or no on this one..

Art

 

[Kingantz]

So are we also tossing out the highest price when determining price..>>?? I didnt see a definite yes or no on this one..

Art

Would you mind giving an example?

 

[mrrt]

Reading through this discussion here are my thoughts...IMO you should never be involving the highest price in your average for a pass. This isn't a floating average game.

There is no example to be given, unless you want to count cigarcyclopedia listing 15 Titans for $659 from BestCigar. This price is way out of line with all the other quotes and probably should be tossed. I guess I'm actually wondering if whether you toss the high end or not isn't determined on a case by case basis or if there is a flat rule that says toss the high end.

I was actually refering to the quote above from insight.


art

 

[Kingantz]

Reading through this discussion here are my thoughts...IMO you should never be involving the highest price in your average for a pass. This isn't a floating average game.

There is no example to be given, unless you want to count cigarcyclopedia listing 15 Titans for $659 from BestCigar. This price is way out of line with all the other quotes and probably should be tossed. I guess I'm actually wondering if whether you toss the high end or not isn't determined on a case by case basis or if there is a flat rule that says toss the high end.

I was actually refering to the quote above from insight.


art

I believe Phil may have been talking about the Ashton example. On TheCigarStore.com, they have the Ashton with a Retail Price of $343.50, and then a "Your Price" listing of $236.86. We don't want to use the $343.50 price as that would inflate the price per stick. If you take a look at Cyclopedia, most of the box prices are around that $240 mark, so these would be the box prices we use. Make sense?

Of course, as you said Art, it may be on a case by case basis. I know there's a few cigars in the pass I paid a good bit higher than MSRP for, however I'm not looking to get a cigar in trade for what I paid, but only for what it's worth.

 

[mrrt]

Thanks Greg and sorry for all the questions. I have no problems with the case by case thing and was just looking for some clarification.

Art

 

[Kingantz]

Thanks Greg and sorry for all the questions. I have no problems with the case by case thing and was just looking for some clarification.

Art

Oh no way man, don't be sorry for asking questions. Keep 'em comin'!

 

[mrrt]

That is so the wrong answer. I ask alot of questions :laugh:

art

 

[CigarMan Andy]

Whew, we haven't even got the pass on the road and look at all the good stuff going! Andy, sorry you're getting to be the "guinea pig" up front. Fun though, right? :blush:

Lots of good discussion and information being passed around here. Insight is correct that this doesn't need to be too complicated, although we do want to learn, me as much as the next person. For the intents and purposes of this pass, we will use Cigarcyclopedia to determine pricing as long as there are enough box prices listed. If there's not enough listed, check out a few sites to get prices. Cigarcyclopedia lists the lowest prices at each vendor, so that's what we will use if looking at different sites.

Does this make sense to everyone?

Loving it. A good education in cigarology. Or is it Stogiology. LOL SO here is the final line up.

1) Take - Diamond Crown Maximus Pyramid #3 MSRP $18.50
2) Take - Don Pepin Black Lancero MSRP $9.99
3) Take - Padron 1926 No.2 MSRP $15.95

1) Put - Diamond Crown Maduro Torpedo #7 MSRP $18.95
2) Put - Don Pepin Garcia JJ Belicoso MSRP $8.95
3) Put - Opus X Super Belicoso MSRP $13.95 but some rarity

Let's do it with fun "guinea pig" style...

 

[Kingantz]

Whew, we haven't even got the pass on the road and look at all the good stuff going! Andy, sorry you're getting to be the "guinea pig" up front. Fun though, right? :blush:

Lots of good discussion and information being passed around here. Insight is correct that this doesn't need to be too complicated, although we do want to learn, me as much as the next person. For the intents and purposes of this pass, we will use Cigarcyclopedia to determine pricing as long as there are enough box prices listed. If there's not enough listed, check out a few sites to get prices. Cigarcyclopedia lists the lowest prices at each vendor, so that's what we will use if looking at different sites.

Does this make sense to everyone?

Loving it. A good education in cigarology. Or is it Stogiology. LOL SO here is the final line up.

1) Take - Diamond Crown Maximus Pyramid #3 MSRP $18.50
2) Take - Don Pepin Black Lancero MSRP $9.99
3) Take - Padron 1926 No.2 MSRP $15.95

1) Put - Diamond Crown Maduro Torpedo #7 MSRP $18.95
2) Put - Don Pepin Garcia JJ Belicoso MSRP $8.95
3) Put - Opus X Super Belicoso MSRP $13.95 but some rarity

Let's do it with fun "guinea pig" style...

Sorry Andy, got to do it to you again. No. 2 isn't good, has to be equal in value or better. The Ashton actually worked if you want to put that back.

Does anyone have any thoughts on the Padron/Opus trade? Does the limited availability of the Opus bump it up to meet the price of the Padron?

Easy question, isn't it? :laugh:

 

[wavescrashing]

Greg, the Opus for the Padron question is kinda tough. Age is often a factor that brings up a price on a stick, but rarity is often subjective unless it's an obvious rare stick. For instance, the AF 858 Rosado retails for under $5, but is absolutely impossible to find, and I've never seen someone sell one for under $25. In this case, I guess we'd have to know if it's aged, and everything else. I'm not familiar with every vitola in the Opus lineup. Is the super belicoso rarer than others, or did you mean harder to find because it is sold seasonally?

 

[Sweetrice80]

Whew, we haven't even got the pass on the road and look at all the good stuff going! Andy, sorry you're getting to be the "guinea pig" up front. Fun though, right? :blush:

Lots of good discussion and information being passed around here. Insight is correct that this doesn't need to be too complicated, although we do want to learn, me as much as the next person. For the intents and purposes of this pass, we will use Cigarcyclopedia to determine pricing as long as there are enough box prices listed. If there's not enough listed, check out a few sites to get prices. Cigarcyclopedia lists the lowest prices at each vendor, so that's what we will use if looking at different sites.

Does this make sense to everyone?

Loving it. A good education in cigarology. Or is it Stogiology. LOL SO here is the final line up.

1) Take - Diamond Crown Maximus Pyramid #3 MSRP $18.50
2) Take - Don Pepin Black Lancero MSRP $9.99
3) Take - Padron 1926 No.2 MSRP $15.95

1) Put - Diamond Crown Maduro Torpedo #7 MSRP $18.95
2) Put - Don Pepin Garcia JJ Belicoso MSRP $8.95
3) Put - Opus X Super Belicoso MSRP $13.95 but some rarity

Let's do it with fun "guinea pig" style...

Sorry Andy, got to do it to you again. No. 2 isn't good, has to be equal in value or better. The Ashton actually worked if you want to put that back.

Does anyone have any thoughts on the Padron/Opus trade? Does the limited availability of the Opus bump it up to meet the price of the Padron?

Easy question, isn't it? :laugh:

Question, What if my put was within cents less like lets say maybe .10 cent less than my take?. Is that a fine line or in general that Ok?

 

[CigarMan Andy]

Whew, we haven't even got the pass on the road and look at all the good stuff going! Andy, sorry you're getting to be the "guinea pig" up front. Fun though, right? :blush:

Lots of good discussion and information being passed around here. Insight is correct that this doesn't need to be too complicated, although we do want to learn, me as much as the next person. For the intents and purposes of this pass, we will use Cigarcyclopedia to determine pricing as long as there are enough box prices listed. If there's not enough listed, check out a few sites to get prices. Cigarcyclopedia lists the lowest prices at each vendor, so that's what we will use if looking at different sites.

Does this make sense to everyone?

Loving it. A good education in cigarology. Or is it Stogiology. LOL SO here is the final line up.

1) Take - Diamond Crown Maximus Pyramid #3 MSRP $18.50
2) Take - Don Pepin Black Lancero MSRP $9.99
3) Take - Padron 1926 No.2 MSRP $15.95

1) Put - Diamond Crown Maduro Torpedo #7 MSRP $18.95
2) Put - Don Pepin Garcia JJ Belicoso MSRP $8.95
3) Put - Opus X Super Belicoso MSRP $13.95 but some rarity

Let's do it with fun "guinea pig" style...

Sorry Andy, got to do it to you again. No. 2 isn't good, has to be equal in value or better. The Ashton actually worked if you want to put that back.

Does anyone have any thoughts on the Padron/Opus trade? Does the limited availability of the Opus bump it up to meet the price of the Padron?

Easy question, isn't it? :laugh:

1) Take - Diamond Crown Maximus Pyramid #3 MSRP $18.50
2) Take - Don Pepin Black Lancero MSRP $9.99
3) Take - Padron 1926 No.2 MSRP $15.95

1) Put - Diamond Crown Maduro Torpedo #7 MSRP $18.95
2) Put - Ashton Vintage Cabinet #2 I don't know MSRP any more
3) Put - Opus X Super Belicoso MSRP $13.95 but some rarity

I'm so confused $%^)I_