Strayvector said:
I for one, am very grateful to posts like Kayak's on this topic. As a newbie, it's nice to be warned about bad pricing. I don't see a problem with his post informing newbies about the questionable pricing practices of twcigars. Who cares if he's never shopped with them before. The fact is, their price is outrageous, sean and nooner agree on this, so I don't get why they are bashing KB for his warning. So what if he does this on more than one board. All newbies should be warned. Why? Because those that go there for the "special" Tabacalera prices might think that his FFOX prices are in line and end up getting raped.
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Several points I'd like to make in my last comments on this.
I do not bash kayakinboy, I point out that he has no evidence that TW is gouging. I'm sure his intentions are honorable.
Yes their prices are way over MSRP. Yes,
if they are a Fuente authorized retailer and get them from Fuente, they are gouging. But the Casa Fuente store in Vegas sells Opus X over MSRP too. Are they gouging? Most people including me say no, the prices are excellent for Vegas, they have very high operating costs because of their location, and in addition the Fuente profits go to their charity.
I have 2 issues with his posts. He says TW is gouging ... yet he will not provide a web site they can be purchased for cheaper (not for me personally, I don't want Opus at list, but for the people he is supposed to be helping out here). How is his post useful to cigar smokers, other than the truly naive. I don't see how it is. If he said perhaps "PM for a location with better prices" then yes, his post can be of use to others and I would never have gotten on his case. The "I'm not sharing sources with you" attitude is understandable, but not combined with a gouging declaration. This sort of post is spurrious and of no help to the noobs it is supposed to be helping.
Back to Casa Fuente. They have higher than MSRP prices because of their unique situation. My point is simple: can kayakinboy show me the price basis of TW so we can see what their % markup is? If TW is an authorized retailer then we know their basis and they ARE gouging. I AM NOT SUPPORTING TW HERE .... I AM POINTING OUT YOU SHOULD HAVE CLEAR EVIDENCE OF GOUGING BEFORE CRYING FOUL. However, if they are not an authorized retailer and buy Opus from a secondary source (at MSRP + tax + shipping + ?), it is possible that their % markup is the same as, lower then, or only slightly more than somebody like Tampa Sweethearts, which appears to sell on MSRP and usually has some of the better Fuentes in stock.
Since kayakinboy has not shown conclusively that TW is gouging, because he hasn't shown me TW's basis, his cry of gouging is foul. Now Moki made a good point, using one of their replies to a comment I made over on CS, that it appears they ARE authorized Fuente retailers. If in fact they are, I owe kayakinboy an apology and I would be the first to put my hand up and say so. However, I do not see the evidence as B&W as Moki did. If they are on te list of authorized retailers (perhaps somebody with connections can straighten that out), then I am clearly wrong here ... they are gouging. But I'd like to see that proven before shadowposts appear all over the place as they have.
I reserve my "last comments" in case I need to officially apologize to kayakinboy in the event it is clear TW IS an authorized retailer.
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