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a heads-up for speeders

The National Motorists Association is a heck of a group. I first saw this website when I clicked on a link from some libertarian article that I was reading years ago. I love the part about contesting a speeding ticket. They will let you use a nine pound "kit" that contains everything on how to appeal your ticket. some of the things sound dubious at best, but it's worth a try if someone feels that their rights are not being respected.
http://www.speedtrap.org/ticket/index.html
 
I gotta be honest with you - althought it's very amusing, the site is only accurate a small percentage of the time. The problem is the reports are from people who were stopped by the local police, and they are giving their take of what the cop was doing - most times, I hate to say, they were wrong... They were trying to make sense of a situation they do not understand, having not been trained or worked in the law enforcement field. I would think that an officer would get sick of running radar day after day, hour after hour, in the same location.... That would truly SUCK!!!

I think you can assume that MOST (if not all) police agencies in the United States have means to determine the speed of a vehicle (radar, stop watch, VASCAR, laser, etc.). The devices are relatively cheap - and easy to operate. In MOST communities, the largest number of citizen complaints to local government concern vehicle operation in their neighborhood (most are upset about speeding cars in front of their house!). Which means, they can be anywhere at any time clocking cars...

The bottom line is - IF YOU DON'T SPEED, YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT A SPEEDING TICKET!
 
When I was but an inkfant, I had a neon "Stop Me" sign on my front grill (or was it on the hood scoop).
Now-a-days, I leave earlier, watch out for the nuts and just shake my head when I see my former self laying down $20 in rubber.
 
ggiese said:
I gotta be honest with you - althought it's very amusing, the site is only accurate a small percentage of the time. The problem is the reports are from people who were stopped by the local police, and they are giving their take of what the cop was doing - most times, I hate to say, they were wrong...

The bottom line is - IF YOU DON'T SPEED, YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT A SPEEDING TICKET!
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Here's what someone said about a US Hwy in my area.

Heading north or south, when you speed up, the State Police pops up behind you and before you know it...You have a speeding ticket. On the week ends they have the Wolf Pack. This is a combined task force of State and Town police looking for violators. If you get caught, you have a ticket. Slow up between Port Richey and Spring Hill Florida on U.S. Highway 19.
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The speed limit there is either 45 or 50 all the up US 19.

How can that be a speed trap? :whistling:
 
Excuse me while I whip out my soapbox.... Uh-hmmmmm... Is this on????

The State Police in my area do Wolf Packs too - along most of the major highways in my area (Chicago area). And when they hit - LOOK OUT!!!! (I've seen them with 20 or 30 cars pulled over at one time).... BUT - if you drive on the expressways in the Chicago area, in the RIGHT lane - going the posted speed limit (55 mph) - you will get KILLED!!!! Certain drivers in this area LOVE to do in the 90's - weaving through traffic - tailgating - and otherwise making a nusiance of themselves. God love the State Police for stopping those idiots and writing them!

My wife and I, along with our children, were driving along one of the stretches of interstate near our home. I was in my van and I developed a problem with one of my tires - it began to bulge. I slowed down to the POSTED speed limit (55 mph) in the RIGHT lane so I could drive home and fix it (you definitely don't want to change the tire on the side of the road around here - that is dangerous because of the speeding cars and trucks). I couldn't do much more than 55 because of the vibration, and I CERTAINLY wasn't going to do LESS than that (or I would have been KILLED). A semi truck tractor combo came up behind me doing at least 80 - and apparently wasn't very happy I was doing 55 (in the RIGHT LANE) - he rode my tail less than a car length away (10 feet or so) for well over 5 miles... 80,000 lbs of momentum 10 feet from my bumper - VERY NICE (kinda like being followed by a freight train at less than 10 feet...) He's certainly not going to stop if I do!!!! We were on a three lane Interstate... You would think the knucklehead would go to the middle lane and pass me....

And then there was the nice young lady who, after passing me going 90 mph while I was in the middle lane, flipped me off because I dare go 65 in a 55... This was after she tailgated me for two miles, with bright lights flashing - and there was room to pass on either side of me. What was I thinking...

I don't know how the Wolf Packs work in Florida, but you certainly can't miss the ones here in Illinois. I have not seen any troopers "popping up" out of nowhere to write tickets. But, I usually see the guy who blew by me at over 90 pulled over with one of the wolf pack troopers (it's very difficult to slow down when you're doing 90). And our guys are sneaky - driving unmarked Camaro's, Grand Prix's, Mustangs, etc.

My NORMAL speed is 10 mph over the limit (I hate to admit it, but it's true...). I travel pretty extensively in the midwest (Illinois, Wisconsin, Michigan, Iowa, Minnesota, Indiana) and I haven't been stopped in well over 10 years (knock on wood). I have even driven in Florida recently at those speeds and haven't been bothered.

I will tell you, though, that there are areas I know not to speed through! Especially in northern Wisconsin - but they still don't bother me when I'm doing about 5 miles over the limit. I don't really want to test my 10 mph over theory up there because of the stories I hear about the State Police (NOT off of Speedtrap.org, but from others that have experienced their wrath - in other words, good old fashioned word of mouth) - They DON'T give breaks. (my understanding is there is also a ticket war between Minnesota and Wisconsin State Troopers - they love to write each other).

And I think you bring out my point very clearly. Why is there a Wolf Pack in the area of US 19??? Although the speed limit is 45 to 50, could it be there are complaints about speeding cars through the towns in that area that the police are trying to address? And if so, and you know it's a "speed trap" - why would you speed? I wouldn't - I can't afford to get a ticket!!! As a matter of fact, knowing it is a speed trap (you don't need the Internet to tell you that - the locals will do a good job of letting you know) would make me want to slow down BELOW the usual 10 mph over the limit I do!

We had a local jurisdiction here in Illinois (a very small town in the northern suburbs of Chicago) that WAS WELL known as a "Speed Trap" back at least 4-5 years ago. I NEVER did my customary 10 MPH over because I KNEW. The funny thing is, it was just one cop who just liked writing tickets (about 20-30 a day)... Not the whole department, and it only happened when HE was working. I even heard about this guy while I was getting my hair cut!!!! A year later, that cop's gone. No more speed trap. I truly haven't seen a cop in that town pulling anyone over in well over 3-4 years - and I drive through there all the time. This is the posting, listed as most recently updated 06/2003:

"******* has always been known as one of the biggest speedtraps in Lake county. I used to have a live in ******** and used a police scanner. You would hear ******** cops with people pulled over almost constantly. They will pull you over for anything over the limit." (Took the names out to protect the innocent)

Definately not accurate....

There was also a report of a local jurisdiction that I KNOW doesn't like doing a lot of traffic enforcement. Their chief is one of those commuity oriented people who does not like public press negative about the department. One of the guys I know was called in to the chief's office after writing a few tickets and told, "John Dillinger's been captured - you can slow down now!!!" That being said, why the heck did someone list them as a speed trap??? As a matter of fact, the person wrote,

"...if you're going southboud on ** you can't see the cop, it is obscured by tall grass. I saw a cop on a hill by a small pond north of ****** Rd. I rarely see anyone pulled over and I drive this road everyday, but still watch out the police activity is consistant. that they see the cop hiding in the tall grass" (I again purposely excluded identifying information because I didn't want to give them bad press they don't deserve).

What was that guy thinking??? Nobody stopped - but it's a speed trap???

A coupla years ago, there was a news story here in Illinois about a town somewhere in Florida that was ticketing people like crazy. If I remember right, the AAA listed it as the biggest speed trap in the US. Apparently it was some area where the highway went through the town, going from 65 down to like 40, and the cops were having a field day!!! If I've heard about it in Illinois - I gotta think the people of Florida know about it...

That being said, my advice is again - IF YOU DON'T SPEED, YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT A SPEEDING TICKET!
 
Also.... In regards to speed traps...

According to Speedtrap.org,

"We support more reasonable speed limits, better driver training, improved motorist-to-motorist courtesy, and sensible, easily understood regulations. We oppose heavy-handed enforcement, unfair motorist taxation, speed traps, kangaroo traffic courts, and government edicts that take away your rights as a consumer and user of automobiles. We're working for the establishment of traffic laws based on engineering principles and public consensus."

At least in Illinois (and I believe it applies equally in all 50 states and possessions) the state law is based upon federal guidelines. That means two things related to establishing speed limits (to get away from "speed traps") must be established in order to succesfully prosecute a speeding charge:

1) A speed limit MUST BE established based upon engineering studies of the area. The speed limit set will be based upon traffic studies, accident analysis, roadway geometry, etc. Gone are the days of just popping up a speed limit sign, "just because".

2) The speed limit signs will be posted according to the Federal guidelines as established in a Manual on Uniform Traffic Control Devices (MUTCD), which is further based upon the American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials (AASHTO) A Policy on Geometric Design of Highways and Streets. These publications are adopted in their entirety (as I understand) in all 50 states and US possession. That is why all of the signs, roadmarkings, etc in the US look the same. Certainly, in the past there were jurisdictions that would erect a postage stamp size sign lowering the speed to 5 mph so the cops could keep busy. Gone are those days....

If you unfairly receive a speeding ticket because it has been issued at a TRUE "speed trap" (i.e., the local officials decided to drop the speed limit from 65 to 30 just because they wanted to generate revenue), then it can be successfully challenged in court. Before someone beats me with the "kangaroo court" theory - there is an appeal process, which will wind its way from local, to appellate, to state, to US appellate, to US Supreme courts. While the local court may be "kangaroo" by some peoples standards, their are plenty of cases on the books which do not allow local jurisdictions to write "unfair" speeding tickets as a sole source of revenue. That being said, there is an appeal process in place which will overturn the policies and practices of the local jurisdictions who maintain "speed traps". Most courts I know (especially past the local level) take a dim view of the practice. The upper courts can (and do) make sure jurisdictions under their purview are not creating "speed traps" - but it has to be processed through the system in order for it to happen.

Okay - I'm done.... :sign: Whewwwww.... Too much thinking..... That hurts... Time for a cigar!!!! ;)
 
The speed traps listed in my city are accurate. The cops here will hide in the gates of the Santa Anita Race Track. I see them all the time when I'm coming home from Pasadena. The speed limit is 45 then quickly becomes 40 once you hit the Race Track area, which is where the speed trap is. Just got a radar detector or Christmas, it works quite well. :)
 
Rod said:
The speed traps listed in my city are accurate.
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mine, too.

but what I think is cool about the site is that if somebody doesn't agree or finds an inaccuracy with anything submitted to the site :rolleyes: :whistling: then they can submit a correction, or at least a differing opinion, about a specific "trap" (or whatever) that they might have experience with.

for example, here's a submission about one in my area:

"The westbound lane is posted 35 mph. The eastbound lane is unposted which, in a business district is 25 mph. There cannot be a street with different speed limits for different lanes.
DMV license examiners will use the 25 mph limit to take points off your driving examination. They are incorrect. Ask to see a supervisor."

which would've been incredibly helpful to know. but then somebody else submitted a comment to that submission with an update:

"Speed limit is now posted at 40 mph"

I'll give that heads-up a thumbs-up. :thumbs:

again, anything that somebody thinks is inaccurate or disagreeable can be commented on to be seen by everybody who views the posted submissions.

and of course the bottom line is- "IF YOU DON'T SPEED, YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT A SPEEDING TICKET!"...but in the real world, legality aside, where abstinence helps prevent aids and/or pregnancy, and not eating fatty or sugary foods helps prevent obesity, it's nice to know ways around those systems when the "bottom lines" might not be reasonable or desirable for somebody. ;)
 
Rod said:
The speed traps listed in my city are accurate. The cops here will hide in the gates of the Santa Anita Race Track. I see them all the time when I'm coming home from Pasadena. The speed limit is 45 then quickly becomes 40 once you hit the Race Track area, which is where the speed trap is. Just got a radar detector or Christmas, it works quite well. :)
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Those bastids are writing for 5 over??? Haven't those cops got anything better to do??? :angry:
 
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