A Petition to Cigar Manufacturers

[Doc Stogie Fresh]

To my brothers and sisters at CigarPass,

I just recently posted a petition to cigar manufacturers that is basically asking them to give us more timely, and accurate information about cigars. It is just too hard to find complete and comprehensive information about cigar. If this kind of information isn't forthcoming from the manufacturers, where then can we get it? If the people who make cigars can't give us the straight scoop, who can?!

I believe we need to work together to urge cigar manufacturers to better inform us as cigar smokers. And to give us the kind of information that will make our cigar hobby much more enjoyable and productive. To make a change, we need to send a BIG message from A LOT of people.

Basic stuff that needs to be more informative include giving us more cigar info on (and/or inside) cigar boxes and better information on websites. And, more timely updates of information on new cigars.

It's all spelled out in the petition. Please take some time to read this petition, and if you agree with the statements in the petition: sign it. It's as simple as that.

Here it is: http://www.stogiefresh.com/petition/

Thanks,

Doc

 

[Jinxedwarrior]

Signed this earlier, when it was posted on Twitter.

 

[Yeahthatsme]

I think, that considering the issues facing us as a hobby and industry, making demands to the cigar companies not related to fighting smoking bans/tax raises might be a bit much. One persons opinion, of course.

 

[Doc Stogie Fresh]

I think, that considering the issues facing us as a hobby and industry, making demands to the cigar companies not related to fighting smoking bans/tax raises might be a bit much. One persons opinion, of course.

Yeah, I do see your point, but I believe that it has been the general nature of secrecy and mystique that the cigar industry has used as a method to promote (sic) their products that has had a large role to play in their current problems. The wine industry is not suffering the same as the cigar industry, even in the midst of the current economic downturn.

I realize this is a complex issue, but the wine industry has never made this a club mentality where only the few are afforded knowledge of what goes on behind the scenes. The wine industry has been totally transparent from the beginning. They want the wine consumer to know more about every possible facet of the industry and in this way they have created a larger cadre of supporters and stakeholders. The cigar industry has done just the opposite. They have shrouded their products in mystery and as a result, they are not affording the same courtesies to the cigar consumer.

Well, this is probably not the time or place to trumpet this one way or the other. People who sign the petition (or not) will have their own views, but I have been following the cigar industry practices for quite some time and have been following the wine industry practices for even longer. I can see two separate and distinct phenomenons have developed and I can clearly see a need for the cigar industry to follow some of the practices of the wine industry. Especially where it involves creating and sustaining new cigar smokers, hobbyists and collectors.

Doc

 

[SewerRanger]

I realize this is a complex issue, but the wine industry has never made this a club mentality where only the few are afforded knowledge of what goes on behind the scenes. The wine industry has been totally transparent from the beginning. They want the wine consumer to know more about every possible facet of the industry and in this way they have created a larger cadre of supporters and stakeholders. The cigar industry has done just the opposite. They have shrouded their products in mystery and as a result, they are not affording the same courtesies to the cigar consumer.

I'm with you a 100%. I've posted reviews of a bunch of cigars now and I've almost always posted something along the lines of "Where the hell do you even get this info?". Vineyards have been supply the same thing for years and it allowed a large group of people to be knowledgeable about wines. This removed a lot of the mystique and "high society" feel to wine and so it's grown into a large industry. Cigar companies seem to have gone the opposite direction and that leaves cigars out of the main stream.

 

[Doc Stogie Fresh]

I realize this is a complex issue, but the wine industry has never made this a club mentality where only the few are afforded knowledge of what goes on behind the scenes. The wine industry has been totally transparent from the beginning. They want the wine consumer to know more about every possible facet of the industry and in this way they have created a larger cadre of supporters and stakeholders. The cigar industry has done just the opposite. They have shrouded their products in mystery and as a result, they are not affording the same courtesies to the cigar consumer.

I'm with you a 100%. I've posted reviews of a bunch of cigars now and I've almost always posted something along the lines of "Where the hell do you even get this info?". Vineyards have been supply the same thing for years and it allowed a large group of people to be knowledgeable about wines. This removed a lot of the mystique and "high society" feel to wine and so it's grown into a large industry. Cigar companies seem to have gone the opposite direction and that leaves cigars out of the main stream.

Amen to that, brother. Well said.

Doc

 

[H311oLHD]

I don't see why cigar manufacturers can't give us at least SOME of the information that is being asked for. I would absolutely love to know when a box has been finished & packed, AKA: a "born on" date. How hard would that be for manufacturers to get a stamp out, and stamp a date on there?

 

[Doc Stogie Fresh]

I don't see why cigar manufacturers can't give us at least SOME of the information that is being asked for. I would absolutely love to know when a box has been finished & packed, AKA: a "born on" date. How hard would that be for manufacturers to get a stamp out, and stamp a date on there?

Agreed! Don Pepin is the only non-Cuban-cigar manufacturer that has put box dates on his cigars on a regular basis.

I believe that, if we can make cigar manufacturers see how important having this type of information is to us as consumers, that they might at least incorporate some of the suggestions in the petition.

Doc

 

[JDC20]

I don't understand what type of information you are looking for? Do you have any specifics?

 

[JDC20]

I don't see why cigar manufacturers can't give us at least SOME of the information that is being asked for. I would absolutely love to know when a box has been finished & packed, AKA: a "born on" date. How hard would that be for manufacturers to get a stamp out, and stamp a date on there?

This is something that retailers are against. You and I as cigar enthusiast can appreciated finding an older box of cigars, but remember we are the minority in this industry. To the everyday cigar smoker seeing an old box of cigars means they aren't "Fresh" or they are "Stale".

 

[JDC20]

Cigar Information: What we'd like to know about the cigars

* List all the tobacco types (varietals) and percentages used in the blend
* Include the placement of leaves on the tobacco plant when listing tobacco types (i.e., ligero, viso, seco, etc.)
* Provide the Nation of origin and the Region of each of the tobaccos used in the blend


After checking your site I'll play devils advocate

1. Why would a manufacturer limit his customer base by revealing a "secret" about his cigars. For example, many people will discount certain types of tobacco, such as Mexican Maduro wrappers. These wrappers are widely used in the industry and not referred to as Mexican but just a non-distinct maduro wrapper. They do things like this to not let a consumers preconceived notion of a certain tobacco influence their purchase of a product.

2. A Ligero labeled cigar appeals to a very small customer base, again why limit a your customer base? This type of labeling can draw a certain cigar smoker to try it but it can also scare an equal number away.

3. Again, refer to point #1. If it is a good cigar, people will buy it and smoke it regardless of where it came from or how much information is given about it.

Not trying to knock your idea, I think it is good, but I think we are getting all the information that the manufacturers want us to get.

 

[vudu9]

"List all the tobacco types (varietals) and percentages used in the blend
* Include the placement of leaves on the tobacco plant when listing tobacco types (i.e., ligero, viso, seco, etc.)
* Provide the Nation of origin and the Region of each of the tobaccos used in the blend "


Alot of what you ask are secrets to the blend specific. I would never tell which farm field, lot, section that certain tobaccos of mine come from for it would reveal too much of my "recepie" so-to-speak to other manufacturers. I would also NEVER tell anyone the %'ages used or leaf placement. Just by inverting the Banda/Capote combination can dramatically change the complextion of a cigar in many circumstances. That it, I've said too much already!

 

[NullSmurf]

"List all the tobacco types (varietals) and percentages used in the blend
* Include the placement of leaves on the tobacco plant when listing tobacco types (i.e., ligero, viso, seco, etc.)
* Provide the Nation of origin and the Region of each of the tobaccos used in the blend "


Alot of what you ask are secrets to the blend specific. I would never tell which farm field, lot, section that certain tobaccos of mine come from for it would reveal too much of my "recepie" so-to-speak to other manufacturers. I would also NEVER tell anyone the %'ages used or leaf placement. Just by inverting the Banda/Capote combination can dramatically change the complextion of a cigar in many circumstances. That it, I've said too much already!

Oh yeah, something else shrowded in secrecy! :sign:

Hows life, Dion? :laugh:

Seriously though, proprietary information. Seriously proprietary. I could probably find out with a plane ticket and a few hundred bucks in folding money. Luckily for Dion, et.al., the latter is in short supply. There is a line here, Doc. How close do you want to get?

 

[NorcalMark]

I totally agree with what Dion said. But it would make it a bit easier to sell if we knew what cigars had what tobacco.

I liken it to the coca cola theory...does anyone really know the formula?

 

[H311oLHD]

Dion,

What's your take on dating boxes??? That's the part I really agree w/.

-Aaron

 

[indyrob]

I've never seen a beer list all the information about their brew I wouldn't ask the guys who make our cigars to either.

 

[baldheadracing]

Random points:

- I got the impression Doc was asking for the moon, but that it would be nice if at least some of the information was out there - and, like wine, it matters more at the high-end of the market.

- One thing that skews the wine industry - where, I assume, Doc was inspired to draw his demands from - are legal requirements, especially those outside of the USA. Protected origins don't really have much legal standing in the USA, e.g., "American Champagne."

- Nobody wants to or should release competitive information - to take Doc's wine analogy a bit sideways (and make it better, I think), one won't be told the exact breakdown of a brandy or a blended whisky - but you will probably find a lot more information about the origins and aging of cognacs and scotches than you will about cigars!

Aside about dates: DPG isn't the only one. Padrons have the date on a little slip of paper in the box, and Gran Habano has (had?) the year of production on the box.

 

[42]

I don't see why cigar manufacturers can't give us at least SOME of the information that is being asked for. I would absolutely love to know when a box has been finished & packed, AKA: a "born on" date. How hard would that be for manufacturers to get a stamp out, and stamp a date on there?

Agreed! Don Pepin is the only non-Cuban-cigar manufacturer that has put box dates on his cigars on a regular basis.

I believe that, if we can make cigar manufacturers see how important having this type of information is to us as consumers, that they might at least incorporate some of the suggestions in the petition.

Doc

For what it's worth: every box of Padron I have purchased has a little paper slip with the roller's name and date boxed among other things. :thumbs:

 

[SewerRanger]

This is something that retailers are against. You and I as cigar enthusiast can appreciated finding an older box of cigars, but remember we are the minority in this industry. To the everyday cigar smoker seeing an old box of cigars means they aren't "Fresh" or they are "Stale".

Only for now because people don't know any better. Once the information is freely available people, even "lay" people, will catch on. I believe that is the point.

3. Again, refer to point #1. If it is a good cigar, people will buy it and smoke it regardless of where it came from or how much information is given about it.

I believe this is the entire point of knowing everything. If you've got a favorite cigar and it turns out that it was made with Mexican maduro wrappers, you'll be more inclined to try more cigars made with the same wrapper. I'll agree that if it's a good cigar you'll smoke it no matter what it's made from, but if it's an untested cigar, wouldn't it be nice to know what it's made from so you can get an idea of what flavors to expect? I know California wines will taste a certain way and I know Italian wines will taste a certain way. I'd like to know if that next cigar I bought will taste similar to the previous one. As it stands now, I've no idea.

I've never seen a beer list all the information about their brew I wouldn't ask the guys who make our cigars to either.

Stone brewing company does it and so do a bunch of other craft brews. Personally this is something I'd like to see catch on with more brewers also. Sam Adams does to an extent (on their website it list the plato, gravity, main source of malt and the hops). I don't think Doc is asking for an exact break down of what goes in the cigar, but just a listing. I've read 5 different reviews of the same cigar and none of them can agree on the filler and binder.

 

[Mowee]

Gee you will get this soon enough if the FDA bill passes Congress. Seriously, why on earth would any manufacturer want to give up his blend just so someone can copy it? Doc you are out in California-- land where there are fake Padrons. Why help the counterfeiters? Also it is pretty difficult to write down what tobacco is what since Dominicans call it one thing and Nicaraguans call it something else. Their primings can be different as well.

As for the wine analogy...most of what you read on the bottle is simply PR BS. They really don't tell you anything....again they don't want to give up their formula.

And while some manufacturers do date their boxes, the retailers do not like that at all.


Sorry Doc...dumb idea.