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Baseball

Horse

Horse

Member 200
Joined
Aug 1, 2001
Messages
2,981
Location
Cowtown
I've been either playin or watchin the "Great Game" all my life. I'm a confessed purist. Yeah I'm a Rangers fan, but I would rather the AL have not ever adopted the DH. I can understand the difficulty in deciding wth to do with the numbers already put up by today's steroid users..as it would be impossible to prove/disprove any previous usage by players gone by. But where does it stop? Who stops it? How/who do they regulate it?

What's your take?

Where's it gonna end up?

Should Barry's records stand? or will/should there be a little (*) next to his name?

Will/should the gov get involved?

What other sports are roids affecting?







ps..If you don't care for baseball..fine..stfu..I don't wanna hear about your dislike for the game.
 
As a fellow purist, I'm up in the air as well. I've been a Braves fan all my life, and while I don't have a problem with someone breaking Hank Aaron's record, I don't want to see it broken by someone who is cheating. The only problem with asterisks here is you've got to prove someone was doing it. I just don't think that will ever happen, and it's truly unfortunate that a cloud of suspicion will forever hang over some of baseball's most cherished records. I don't think the government should be involved, for the sole reason that the government should never have HAD to get involved. You can't just blame Bud Selg or Donald Fehr, because it's everyone's fault who was in a position to change the policy. MLB didn't change their steroid policy as a self-motivated stride to improve the game. They had their arm twisted by Congress and the court of public opinion until they caved. Very sad.


That being said, I can't freakin' wait for the season to start. Go Braves!
 
I love the game big Mariners fan which can be very frustrating at times. Life long Giant fan Willie Mays is my man. I have to think he is apalled at his Godson! I think the Players Union and Owners need to stop thinking about $$$$$$$$$ and more about preserving the game. I still feel the new current testing and number of strikes for abusers is way to lenient.

With that said I can't wait till season starts. Have been thinking of hopping a plane to AZ to catch a couple of Cactus League games.
 
Yeah...I've played the game throughout college and I can remember getting tested by the NCAA at least three (3) times in one year. Nobody that I know of ever was on the juice, nor could any of us afford it anyway - but the Pro's have been getting away with this for quite some time.

It's about time that something is finally done about it, but unfortunately too late. Major scar for the game - at least in my book!

Barry and the rest of the "cheating" Ya-Hoos should get their stats and records expunged! Absolute disgrace. In my firm opinion it was cheating!

They say that roids can no help or aid the eye to hit a 95 mph. fastball, but the juice sure can help out with muscle memory, improve strength and aid the body in recovering from the daily grind.

O.K. thats my .025
 
Atchafalaya said:
O.K. thats my .025
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not your 2 cents or 3 cents, just somewhere inbetween, huh? :p

i too am a fan of the little red shoed rangers.

however, im not a fan barry bonds who is quickly becoming the baseball antichrist. there will always be an astrict beside his hr record, maybe not visually, but everyone will see it. and make no mistake eshaw. this is not just one of baseball's most cherished records. its the most cherished in all of sports.
 
If it's proven that a player has taken steroids ANYTIME during his career, they should be banned from baseball for life and all records that he holds be erased. Drug testing four times a year, anytime during the year with no notice.

That's the only way MLB will get their respect back.
 
Steroids were NEVER against the rules of the game. Make any amount of noise you wish, but it is the truth. Until this year there was no policy in place to ban steroids. Up until this season, NO players are cheaters that used steroids. Those of you who wish to blame players and claim to be purist (hhhuuummm BS) seem to always forget the facts. Barry Bonds is a jackass by all accounts, but he is NOT a cheater to date. He is actually one of the 3 greatest to ever play the game. JMHO... :)
 
While I hate to admit it, gr8full2day is correct. It was not illegal to use and you can't hold that against anyone. If you did then all the early 20th century players who used "Patent Medicines" of their day would be suspect too since many contained now illegal drugs.
 
You gotta be a little older to call BS on this one.

Wanting to ban steroids does NOT a purist make.
Read my original post again, I said I'm a purist and the next thing I said was I don't like the DH spot in the line-up.

But lemme list my gripes as a purist:
1. Get rid of the DH
2. Put the mound back up where it used to be, it was lowered 5-6 inches (depending on what park you were at) in 1969..ahem, before some folks here were born but while others here were already in love with the game.
3. The strike zone has shrunk to a gnat's ass..1988's rule change lowered the top of the zone drastically. Take it back to the armpits or shoulders and the knees where it was for nearly 100 years.

And as a final note, not as a purist, but legally speaking...anabolic steroids are illegal in the United States without a prescription. So yeah, there are rules about steroids and always have been.

Take that and spin on it a while.
 
The problem is that the items defined as anabolic steroids changes. For example the new Federal law (Anabolic Steroid Control Act of 2004 ) that went into place on 1/22/05 adds 26 new items to the anabolic steroid list. All of these were legal up to that date.

BTW, I agree about the strike zone, although I'm not sure that the mound needs to be raised back. Oh....and make the pitchers hit too, get rid of the DH.

Horse said:
And as a final note, not as a purist, but legally speaking...anabolic steroids are illegal in the United States without a prescription. So yeah, there are rules about steroids and always have been.

Take that and spin on it a while.
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The love of the game has surely been lost and MLB has driven the game towards the hitter. Longball is what sells. Sad to say.

My love for baseball absolutely died when they canceled the WS back in 94. All the finger pointing by both sides told me what they were all in the game for. There is no one that plays any kind of profesional sports worth millions of dollars in my book.

I don't follow the game anymore short of the "big" stories. I've moved on to a better sport where men are men and the women drink beer. Bowling is the only game for me now. :)
 
The NFL is the only league that is done right. NBA - GUARANTEED player salaries. Being in Philly I saw Glen Robinson being payed millions not even playing a game getting traded in part for Jamal Mashburn getting payed millions and retiring. NHL - Out of business? Are you kidding me? And the MLB... In the NFL, if you don't perform you get cut regardless. Theres a hard cap so every team can be competitive, depsite media market. They make cash hands over fist and still have slow expansion.

That aside, what has been said from both camps is the exact way i feel. Technically it wasnt cheating, honestly if you cared about the game you wouldnt do it. But the problem is all about greed. Players in the Dominican shoot horse vitamins in their asses to get an extra ten MPH on their fastball. The cash is there, Renteria didnt even like baseball, he loved soccer, but he could excel at baseball so there he is. Just like Canseco, he didnt like (or respect) the game, he just was good at it and knew he could make a buck at it. Can't say I know from experience but from what I've heard, players in the 50's and 60's would have jobs in the offseason. Its not the game, its the times.
 
Baseball players have a long and storied history of cheating. We fondly look back at players like Gaylord Perry and Don Sutton for doctoring the ball. Nettles and Brett for corking their bats. How about Willie Mays? Him and most of the players of his era were all high on speed. Greenies they called them. Are you going to asterik everything? Talking about steriods, don't let Sosa and McGwuire stray to far in your mind. They were likely loaded up too.

What about other supplements? Over the counter stuff? Do you have a problem with people taking that stuff? You say it is legal in baseball to take it? Well, steriods were not banned at the time?

The fact is, Barry Bonds is the greatest hitter and player of this generation. If he wasn't such an ass to the media, we would all love him. But he is so hated by the media that it rubs off on the rest of us.

There will come a time when we are telling our grandchildren of Barry Bonds and what a treat it was to watch him play. I am very fortunate to have personally seen him in dozens if not a hundred games live. The day will comes when he will be heralded as the greatest of all time but that will come long after he is dead.

I wish I didn't know all this. Until this steriod stuff came out, I never knew Willie Mays and his peers took speed. I grew up idolizing him and the drugs really bother me but I will not let it taint the momories I have as a boy of climbing over the fence to sneak into Candelstick park to watch Mays do things you wouldn't even dream of.
 
Horse said:
I've been either playin or watchin the "Great Game" all my life. I'm a confessed purist. Yeah I'm a Rangers fan, but I would rather the AL have not ever adopted the DH. I can understand the difficulty in deciding wth to do with the numbers already put up by today's steroid users..as it would be impossible to prove/disprove any previous usage by players gone by. But where does it stop? Who stops it? How/who do they regulate it?

What's your take?

Where's it gonna end up?

Should Barry's records stand? or will/should there be a little (*) next to his name?

Will/should the gov get involved?

What other sports are roids affecting?







ps..If you don't care for baseball..fine..stfu..I don't wanna hear about your dislike for the game.
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Sorry about you being a Rangers fan. That can be cured. :whistling:

But where does it stop? It should stop for the most part with the testing program they implemented. Not this or the next year, but soon thereafter

Who stops it? I think the players will ultimately stop it. Bud Selig, blows.

How/who do they regulate it? MLB will regulate it for now and then the players will just let it go

What's your take? I think that baseball is the only sport that takes a beating every few decades and then bounces back. I think that the Hall of Fame is where the real story is going to occur. All of the current inductees will stay; it is the future ones that may have a problem.

Where's it gonna end up? MLB will be fine in a few years. Real fans always forgive. Except Bill Buckner.

Should Barry's records stand? or will/should there be a little (*) next to his name? I hate to say this, but I think the record should stand. It was not a banned substance at the time. However, I think the Hall of Fame may reflect differently.

Will/should the gov get involved? They should get involved only to subpoena the ones they have for next week and let the fans see the responses of the players.

What other sports are roids affecting? It affects everything except curling. Oh, wait there was that article a couple of months ago about steroids in curling. Oh, well.
 
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