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Calling all Canadians

jabba

New Member
Joined
Oct 23, 2005
Messages
1,490
Canadian tobacco taxes ... Has anyone done the math???

I am Canadian.

I was borned, raised and educated in Canada and I currently live in the Greater Toronto Area.

When I tell a foreigner that I am Canadian they generally associate that with two things ... Very cold weather and Very high taxes. Unfortunately both of these things are true. All in all, Canada is a great country but there is definitely room for improvement.

For starters, there is already a group of individuals working on the first issue ... cold weather. Here is the link and I gotta tell you that I love the idea ...

http://www.cfatp.ca/ms.html

I'm pretty sure that if this idea ever comes to fruition I will be one of the first people packing my bag for six months of the year.

I want work on the second issue, taxes, as it relates to the taxing of tobacco products.

I have a big issue with Tobacco taxes in Canada. The government justifies the taxes on tobacco by saying that smokers put financial strain on Canada's health care system therefore this extra tax subsidizes the health care system. First of all, I don't buy this argument for cigars and secondly I don't think you can group cigarettes and cigars into the same category. Let's do some math to illustrate my point. I consider myself a cigar smoker and if I had the time and the money I would smoke 1 cigar per day after dinner(currently I smoke 1-2 cigars per week). Most cigarette smokers I know smoke about 1 pack a day on average.

Here is how tobacco is taxed in Canada...

1) Provincial tobacco taxes

Effective January 19, 2005, the current rates of tax applied on tobacco products is as follows:
11.725¢ per cigarette/cigarette stick
$1.76 per pack of 15 cigarettes
$2.35 per pack of 20 cigarettes
$2.93 per pack of 25 cigarettes
$23.45 per carton of 200 cigarettes
11.725¢ per gram or part gram of cut tobacco
Tax on cigars is 56.6% of the taxable price*

* Taxable price of a cigar defined:
(i) taxable price = the price for which the cigar was purchased by its retail dealer + a prescribed percentage (currently 22%) of that amount; or
(ii) taxable price = the price paid for the cigar by the consumer where a consumer purchases the cigar directly from the manufacturer or importer of the cigar.

2) Federal excise duty

$0.07925 per cigarette

$0.065 per cigar plus 65% of the sale price plus $0.014786 per cigar


3) Federal GST of 7%

(Note: Some provinces even collect a provincial sales tax on tobacco, my example is based on Ontario which does not)

First let's calculate how much taxes a 1 pack/day (25) cigarette smoker pays per year...

$2.93 x 365 days = $1,069.45 (provincial tobacco tax)

$0.07925 * 25 * 365 = $723.16 (federal excise duty)

$8.28 * 7% * 365 = $211.55 (GST)

Now a 1 cigar/day, premium cigar smoker (Let's assume the retail dealer pays $8 for this premium cigar)

$8 + 22% = $9.76

$9.76 * 0.566 = $5.52

$5.52 *365 = $2,014.80 (provincial tobacco tax)

$9.76 * 65% = $6.34+$0.065+$0.014786 = $6.42 * 365 = $2343.30(federal excise duty)

$9.76 + $5.52 + $6.42 + 25%(retailer profit markup) * 7% = $1.90 * 365 = $693.04 (GST)

The result is a 1 pack/day cigarette smoker is paying $2.004.16 per year in taxes and a 1 cigar/day smoker is paying $5051.14 per year.

The total price after tax on a 25-pack of cigarettes $8.85 ... $5.48 is taxes

On an $8 premium cigar, the total price after tax is $29.02 ... $13.84 is taxes!

Someone that smokes 2 cigars a week is paying the same tax as someone that smokes 125 cigarettes a week ... This is totally ludicrous!!!

We (the Canadian cigar community) must seriously ban together to battle the government over this unfair treatment.

posted from http://cigarjournal.blogspot.com/
 
Hi Jabba, thanks for the info. You might want to do an introduction in the appropriate room, let the people know who you are.

Jabba is a long time CFer and was an original on the old JR BB.
 
Hi, jabba! Welcome aboard from Texas. Yes, I think that the tropical province idea is great. I live here in the beautiful Texas Hill Country. Each winter, many Canadians become "Winter Texans", and come to my area to stay for the winter. By the way, I have visited British Columbia in the past, and I enjoyed my visit very much. The country is very beautiful there. I visited Vancouver, Victoria; Nanaimo; Penticton; and Kelowna. Yes, in my opinion, the Canadian tobacco taxes are very unfair. I hope that this situation soon improves for you. Have a great week, jabba! Regards, knightlaird
 
Welcome, jabba! Sorry to hear about the taxes :(
 
Moki,

I was waiting for another tax discussion with you ... take the boat over Lake and i'll buy you a smoke.
 
jabba said:
Moki,

I was waiting for another tax discussion with you ... take the boat over Lake and i'll buy you a smoke.
[snapback]240939[/snapback]​

I may just do that soon -- haven't been on the ferry yet...
 
I agree, way too high! and i don't smoke cigaretes. If i did , i would do what many others are doing and travel to the Indian reserve, and pick up 200 cigs for $14 or raw tobacco. What a shame, cigars are lumped in with this!
:angry2:
 
Sunward said:
I agree, way too high! and i don't smoke cigaretes. If i did , i would do what many others are doing and travel to the Indian reserve, and pick up 200 cigs for $14 or raw tobacco. What a shame, cigars are lumped in with this!
:angry2:
[snapback]240973[/snapback]​

Your right, a lot of Canadians are buying their cigarettes from the Indian reserves.

How about this for a proposal. Make Cuban cigars tax free and use it as draw for tourists. We can be the spain of North America!

(Classic Moki theory of reducing taxes to decrease the deficit ... damn, I think he sold me on it!)
 
It is quite insane..must be tough for a decent cigar shop to thrive in Canada with such high prices on sticks..compare some prices of opus x or padrons 64 or 26 and we pay nearly quadruple what our neighbours pay. I think it's impossible that our govt would do anyhting to make things better for us with regards to this. I'll just to have to buy my duty-free boxes when I visit Cuba.
 
Can't blame the retailer...can't afford to pay those prices either, only just to try one but I couldn't smoke those on a regular basis at those prices..wonder how much money the govt loses from Canadians buying cigars out of the country without paying duties? Unless you're rich it's near impossible to smoke a premium cigar per day at our prices.
 
99% of what I smoke is purchased out of the country ... when I travel to the USA I use the 50 cigar limit for everyone I am with. A Fuente 858 is $3.75 stick in Florida and $22 a stick in Canada, I work hard and refuse to throw away my money. I feel sorry for the Canadian shops but I feel they should ban together and fight the issue.
 
uh guys...i just go to cuba to buy smokes...prices arent bad in havana.most likely cheaper to fly out of hogtown than it is to go from edmonton.

derrek :)
 
jabba said:
99% of what I smoke is purchased out of the country ... when I travel to the USA I use the 50 cigar limit for everyone I am with.  A Fuente 858 is $3.75 stick in Florida and $22 a stick in Canada, I work hard and refuse to throw away my money.  I feel sorry for the Canadian shops but I feel they should ban together and fight the issue.
[snapback]241225[/snapback]​

I do the exact same. Anybody goes to the US I order cigars. The prices here are discusting. The only other thing I don't understand is why are cigar accessories so expensive here, are they taxed like tobacco. A cheap ass humidor here is $200, in the States I cann buy the same humi for $30 and the same goes for cutters. Anyways that's my rant.

Where do you go to have a nice cigar in Toronto?
 
dvickery said:
uh guys...i just go to cuba to buy smokes...prices arent bad in havana.most likely cheaper to fly out of hogtown than it is to go from edmonton.

derrek :)
[snapback]241908[/snapback]​


This seems like a great idea as cigars are way cheaper in Cuba, but do you factor in the price of GOING TO CUBA? LOL. I mean it's gonna cost you money to get there...


I have to agree with the other posts on here, tobacco taxes on cigars are ridiculous.
 
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