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CP users and CBid

IgwanaRob

IgwanaRob

I'm just 2 people short of a threesome
Joined
Jun 8, 2005
Messages
2,210
Location
Under the bed (LI, NY)
In a recent thread, the idea came up of forming some way to ID fellow CP'ers, and to prevent us from outbidding each other (at least unintentionally :p )

The easiest, IMO, is to add a marker in the comments section when you place a bid. Something that would stand out, but not be an eyesore would be best. Maybe in the comments we should put up something that would identify us similar to this:

CP:IgwanaRob

CP for CigarPass (obviously) followed by your CP user name. Or if someone doesn't want to leave their user name for any reason, how about a default ID tag like this:

CP:BOTL

Generic enough, and instantly identifiable.

Thoughts?
 
Fraid I'm against this.
Collusion will cause the vendors to eliminate these auctions.
Prices are good (and fair).
I like a great deal as much as the next guy, but only through legal means.

Jim
 
Not bidding against a friend is collusion? ??? I'll remember that the next time I'm at the live auction I attend with friends. Somehow I don't think they'll appreciate it :0
 
I would never bid against friends, knowing that they wanted something.

As far as CBid goes, the same cigar deal should come around again. Who knows, you may get it for less.

I think it is a good idea.

Collusion http://www.google.com/search?biw=792&hl=en...G=Google+Search

I looked at a ton of the definitions in Google. I do not think that fellow BOTL's are trying to deflate the value of an item, or any of the other negative definitions.

I do hear what you are saying Jim. I just do not think we would be trying to devalue the items.
 
Hmmm, I think I get what Jim is saying but I don't think cbid would discontinue the auction if they caught wind of this and decided they didn't like it.

It seems much more likely that they would simply get rid of the "comments" feature. I have been throwing something in there that shows that I am a CPer in hopes that my CP brothers won't outbid me and have yet to encounter any problems because of it.

I vote for simply "CP:BOTL" :thumbs:
 
It's still a bit unethical.
I am a part time antique dealer and have to bid against friends at auctions frequently.
You are risking suspension of cbid accounts.
Of course, then there will be no one to bid against!
Kinda Catch 22 isnt it?!

Jim
 
I understand where you're coming from, and for the most part it makes sense, but I don't see how identifying yourself a bit more would be a threat to your account.
 
Tenpin said:
Fraid I'm against this.
Collusion will cause the vendors to eliminate these auctions.
Prices are good (and fair).
I like a great deal as much as the next guy, but only through legal means.

Jim
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OK it is a bit drastic, and worng, to state that it would be illegal. There is no code section that I know of that would directly address this issue. If I am at an auction and see friends there and that they are bidding on something they really want, and I could take it or leave it, why not back off? Why not decide together to get it together but not play against each other? Collusion? Possibly. Illegal? Not at all. Unethical? No.

Here is a clip from CBid rules:

1) Fraud
It is a violation of the law to make bids under a false name or with an invalid credit card. We strongly advise you not to test the auction with false bids, as it will put you at substantial personal legal risk. Fraudulent bidders will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. Please be aware that even if you do not give us your real name, your Web browser transmits a unique address to us, which can be used by law enforcement officials to identify you. Both the FBI and the US Secret Service are responsible for investigating all Internet fraud cases.

Users attempting to "cheat" the bidding system by altering or tampering with the course of normal bidding, or by editing bids for the purpose of altering bids or prices in a manner in which it was not intended, may have their bids canceled and their account immediately suspended at the sole discretion of CigarBid.


They are a private site that can make the rules they want. We have agreed to follow these rules by signing up. If they interpreted this activity as a violation of the rules then they could give a warning or cancel our account. (Incidentally I would be a much richer man if they did :D) The law and legality has nothing to do with this situation at all as long as we do not violate any existing penal code section.

If I see an ID tag that I recognize on CBid I will probably PM the guy/girl first before bidding. Thats just me.
 
I always put the intitials CP in the comments section. I don't see anything wrong with it. I would never bid against anybody who had the initials CP in the comments.
 
People have been putting CP, CS, CI, CF etc. etc. after their name for some time. Sometimes it is more prevalent and sometimes it is less. I put CP after my name sometimes depending on my mood.
 
AVB said:
People have been putting CP, CS, CI, CF etc. etc. after their name for some time. Sometimes it is more prevalent and sometimes it is less. I put CP after my name sometimes depending on my mood.
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Very true. I do the same. :)
 
AVB said:
People have been putting CP, CS, CI, CF etc. etc. after their name for some time. Sometimes it is more prevalent and sometimes it is less. I put CP after my name sometimes depending on my mood.
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DITTO!!!!

And besides that, if I'm bidding on something I want....I really don't care who else is bidding or where they are from.
 
This idea is nothing new. About 3 years ago someone decided to start identifiying themself as a CP member for the exact same reason. Personally, I don't see anything wrong with identifying who you are or where you're from. Let's face it, cbid is not only used by CP members, it's used by members of ALL cigar boards and more.
 
I think that you will find that this is an example of collusion. Check out this VERY INFORMATIVE Link...

http://www.epiqtech.com/auction_software-Collusion.htm


I have no problem identifying myself as a CP member when placing a bid.
What I disagree with is an agreement that we don't bid against each other.

I liked what S&S said "... if I'm bidding on something I want....I really don't care who else is bidding or where they are from."

Jim
 
Clipped from that link:

Generally, rings are made up of bidders who have specific information about the value of what is being sold. This knowledge gives them an advantage over other bidders and also means that they are willing to pay more for the item, even though when they are successful they end up getting a good deal at the seller's expense.
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God forbid we bid on something that we know the value of before bidding. If my knowledge of an items worth give me the advantage over other buyers what is wrong with that? LOL

there is still a method that can be easily used to manipulate the outcome of the auction in favor of the seller. In this method, the seller will usually work with one or more individuals to drive up the price of the item. For example, the seller may be working with Bidder A and Bidder B but not with Bidder C. Bidder C bids $50, then Bidder A bids $75 and Bidder B bids $100. Bidder C wants to win so he bids $125. This back and forth bidding can go on for as long as the auction lasts or until the fake bidders predict Bidder C will give up. When it works successfully, Bidders A and B will stop at a point that maximizes profits for the seller but that doesn't cause Bidder C to get out of the game. Generally, Bidder C will feel a tremendous sense of accomplishment for winning without realizing that he could have gotten the item for much less.
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I often wondered if CBid or other sites utilize this tactic. You hardly ever see an item go for WAY under retail. Make you wonder :whistling:

Despite the probability of collusion, sellers and bidders should never underestimate the creativity and cleverness of unethical individuals.
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Ditto that.

Very interesting article. Thanks for the link Tenpin. However, when it comes right down to it there is nothing we can do to prevent an auction site from using "collusion" against us, and very little they can do to keep bidders from doing what we suggested.

Logistically however I think what has been proposed here would be difficult at best to accomplish. Interesting topic though and I enjoy the debate. :D
 
The whole thing makes sense as to why you would do this, but honestly, isn't that the whole point of an auction? To pay as much as you are willing to, unless you can get it for less? I too would likely bid regardless of who else is involved. The other side is that I typically will just bid the highest amount I am willing to pay and leave it at that. Then if win I win, if not, I move on . .
 
kiltedcraftsman said:
The whole thing makes sense as to why you would do this, but honestly, isn't that the whole point of an auction? To pay as much as you are willing to, unless you can get it for less? I too would likely bid regardless of who else is involved. The other side is that I typically will just bid the highest amount I am willing to pay and leave it at that. Then if win I win, if not, I move on . .
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:thumbs: I would not stop bidding on something simply because a fellow CPer is bidding on it. If I want it, I will pay up to my maximum bid for it and I expect others to do the same. If you are willing to bid more, more power to you and congratulations. That said, I hardly ever buy anything off CBid. :sign:
 
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