Rum Finished Scotch Project

[classyndry]

I received a spirits aging barrel as present a while back. I tried some rum finished scotch recently, and since I had a bunch of rum on hand, I decided I'd try to put a rum finish on a scotch myself. I already have some rum aging in the barrel. Since its a small volume barrel with a lot more surface area than that much rum/scotch would normally see, I'm planning on pulling the rum out in about a month, which would give the rum enough time to seep into the wood and add to the scotch finish. Then I want to put some scotch in, but I don't know how long to shoot for. Right now I'm thinking about starting with something fairly basic, but I've also considered using something a little more intense in flavor. So maybe a Macallan 12 to try to fully taste the rum finish, or maybe like a laphroaig to temper the rum finish with some smoke. What would you guys do? Any idea how long a port, sherry, or rum finish generally takes? I can taste the scotch to evaluate its progress, but since its low volume, each sample means less finished product and more air in the barrel.

EDIT: Changed the thread title to reflect the new direction of the content.

 

[Greggj77]

I received a spirits aging barrel as present a while back. I tried some rum finished scotch recently, and since I had a bunch of rum on hand, I decided I'd try to put a rum finish on a scotch myself. I already have some rum aging in the barrel. Since its a small volume barrel with a lot more surface area than that much rum/scotch would normally see, I'm planning on pulling the rum out in about a month, which would give the rum enough time to seep into the wood and add to the scotch finish. Then I want to put some scotch in, but I don't know how long to shoot for. Right now I'm thinking about starting with something fairly basic, but I've also considered using something a little more intense in flavor. So maybe a Macallan 12 to try to fully taste the rum finish, or maybe like a laphroaig to temper the rum finish with some smoke. What would you guys do? Any idea how long a port, sherry, or rum finish generally takes? I can taste the scotch to evaluate its progress, but since its low volume, each sample means less finished product and more air in the barrel.

I would think that the profile of the Mac 12 with a rum wood finish would be outstanding. As much as I love Laphroaig, the Islays might not compliment the sweetness of the rum very well but, it would be interesting. I have done a little research into re-barreling and from what I read you would want to let is sit for at 2-3mos. But, again this is subjective to how much flavor you would like to achieve with the interaction with the wood.

Check out this website it has some good information that you may find usefull.

http://bourbondork.blogspot.com/2009/11/project-re-barrel-very-old-barton-bib.html

Definitely keep us posted on this project as it sounds like a great experiment.

 

[tomthirtysix]

There's a thread somewhere around here, started by Macion Grey. He bought a small barrel for port, iirc. It was a pretty good write up of his trials trying to get it right, especially with how strong the wood is early on because of the increased surface area. It might give you some good pointers if you can find it.

ETA: Found it. Looks like it didn't have as much info as I thought.
http://www.cigarpass.com/forumsipb/index.php?showtopic=48998&view=findpost&p=723504

 

[classyndry]

Interesting read. Also, interesting point about proof, proof did not factor into my decision making at all this time, but will next time. I think I've decided on using the Macallan. Its something I, and many, are familiar with, so it will provide a good base for comparison. As for the time I'll leave the scotch in the rum cask...I guess I'll just try tasting it weekly. I'd probably would have ended up being impatient and doing it anyway.

 

[Greggj77]

Interesting read. Also, interesting point about proof, proof did not factor into my decision making at all this time, but will next time. I think I've decided on using the Macallan. Its something I, and many, are familiar with, so it will provide a good base for comparison. As for the time I'll leave the scotch in the rum cask...I guess I'll just try tasting it weekly. I'd probably would have ended up being impatient and doing it anyway.

Weekly tasting is probably the best route to take and you get to try it as well so it is a win-win.

Definitely keep us updated as this progresses.

Good Luck!!!

 

[AVB]

I certainly missed this thread. Personally, I wouldn't use a scotch that is already finished such as the Macallan, You already have sherry casking going on with them so you really won't know what the rum is doing. Try straight bourbon cask scotch like any of the standard "Glens" or the 9yo Ardmore. Being a peaty buy not smokey dram the Ardmore would prove quite interesting IMO.

 

[classyndry]

I missed that reply as well. However, I added a little of the unaged rum to some macallan and some glenlivet this week to try to get an idea of how the end result would taste. The former was way too sweet, the other I just didn't really like. I also had a cold at the time which didn't help, but neither did it for me. The rum is still in the barrel and its been two weeks longer than I wanted (month and a half total). I'm going to give that Ardmore a try and hopefully get the rum out and scotch in Monday. Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[classyndry]

UPDATE! Once my cold/allergies subsided, I re-tasted each Scotch with a drop or two of the rum, and came to very different conclusions that I had previously. The Macallan was OK, but the Glenlivet stood out. I also tried some with some Talisker and Balvenie doublewood, and found both of those to be pleasing as well (perhaps a Balvenie triplewood is in my future?). The Macallan was just way too sweet due to the sherry, perhaps its sherry finish is exceedingly long, or perhaps it is balanced in such a way that any additional sweetness just puts its over the top. Next time I give this a try, I'll spend a lot more time planning out which spirits to use, so I won't be rushed when it comes time to make a decision. I find the Glenlivet and rum mix pleasing, but I worry that the subtlety of the Scotch won't hold up to the spice of the rum once it comes out of the barrel. I believe the Glenlivet 12 is sherry finished, but I've seen contradictory information about it online. Without knowing for sure, I relied on my palate, and found that sherry was not noticeable to me, at least not like with the Macallan. The bottom line is that the Glenlivet mixed with a few drops of rum tasted the best to me, so its the Scotch I chose for this experiment. When I was charring the barrel, and recharring after aging the rum, smoke with a wonderful aroma would waft out during the filling of the cask. I think the dearth of peat in the Glenlivet will allow that flavor to shine though if it is prominent enough. If nothing else, this will be a good learning experience. Hopefully if it does not work out, I'll have learned enough to pick a better base Scotch next time.

I intend to give the barrel a taste every 24 hours or so. My research leads me to believe that I'll want to pull the Scotch out between 4 and 8 days.

Side note: The HC that was aged about a month in the barrel shown now screams of vanilla. The nose before my aging was pleasant and had vanilla, but now vanilla is the prominent flavor and smell. I've only had one small taste, and I have not yet tasted the aged rum against unaged HC, but I intend to do so, and detail my experience in my final write up.

Edit: I just realized I did not address the Ardmore suggestion. I was not able to source it easily and I wanted to get the rum out of the cask before it changed too drastically. My goal was originally to age the rum for just under a month, and as it turned out, it stayed in the cask for about a month and a half. I found a place to order the Ardmore online, but I found the Glenlivet and rum mix so pleasing that I decided to just go for it. I may try it next time, but right now I'm also leaning toward the Balvenie triplewood idea.

 

[classyndry]

I pulled about a quarter ounce from the cask to taste its progress (just over 24 hours). I compared the cask to the original, and then, the HC original with the HC that I'd aged 1.5 months in the 1 liter cask. My results follow:

GL VS. GL in HC Cask.
The color for both is identical, though there is some white oak sediment in the GL HC Cask.. Both have a somewhat weak nose. To me, GL has a normal scotch nose, but is subtle. Tasting the GL, I can maybe pick out some salted butter, vanilla, and some heat (for those that dwell on particulars). The GL HC Cask (24hr) has an even tighter nose. It is somewhat different, but I can't even begin to place exactly how. The GL HC Cask (24hr) has spice on the finish, a much longer finish, but is still subtle. I added two drops of water to both: The GL's nose opens up some, but there is little difference in taste. With the GL HC Cask (24hr), I notice a sweet start, and then a long spicy finish. Similar to before, but perhaps more pronounced. While the GL HC Cask (24hr) is sweet, it is not necessarily sweeter than the GL.

I like the progress so far, and the GL HC at 24 hours has seemed to maintain its subtlety, but the rum finish is not quite as pronounced as I'd like to see it get. I'll retaste in a day or two.

HC VS. HC XO (HC in the cask for 1.5 months, then rebottled):
The HC has a nose of honey, vanilla, and wood. The XO surprisingly has a more subtle nose (since I thought it was so strong initially, but not comparatively), I get mainly honey, and some vanilla. Tasting the HC, I get a strong taste of vanilla. Tasting the XO, the vanilla is even more pronounced, overpoweringly so. The vanilla was strong in both, but so much so in the XO, that I went and got a vanilla bean from my pantry for comparison. When comparing the nose of the XO with the actual bean, the XO smelled much more of honey, and more like synthetic vanilla, almost like flavored rum. Not bad or chemicaly, but just not exactly like the actual bean.