What's better'n Guns and Smokes

[Turk10mm]

I competed in a friendly pistol shoot put on by the TXDPSA. Had a blast with smokes and guns. Not to mention, I kicked ass too! I had two perfect evolutions and kept up with the more practiced competition shooters!

Can anyone see what I left at home!!!

 

[tkoepp]

Looks like you had a good time... I'd say that you left your clip holder at home.

Did I win

 

[Turk10mm]

Looks like you had a good time... I'd say that you left your clip holder at home.

Did I win

yup, no mag pouches.. good job!! I had a blast.. now its off to a herf!!

 

[rectifythis]

I'm jealous. Been too tied down with work and family duties to get out and do man stuff. Nothing like the smell of gun powder and cigars in the morning!

 

[Marcos]

Looks like so much fun. I just recently sold my only firearm but look forward to a new acquisition hopefully some time soon.

 

[gunsandcigars88]

Sounds like a great day. I remember when almost all my saturdays were like that, but the sheriff's department isn't really giving me any saturdays off. Haven't had one come to think of it in about 4 months now. Glad to hear you shot well. Not much better than getting out to the range on a nice day with some good smokes and a LOT of ammo.
B

 

[StogieStang]

I'm interested in purchasing my first gun. I'm leaning toward a Glock 17 or 19 9mm. This gun would initially be for fun at the shooting range and I would possibly get a concealed weapons permit later. What do you guys think about the Glock? Any other suggestions?

 

[Turk10mm]

I'm interested in purchasing my first gun. I'm leaning toward a Glock 17 or 19 9mm. This gun would initially be for fun at the shooting range and I would possibly get a concealed weapons permit later. What do you guys think about the Glock? Any other suggestions?

buy a glock and you'll never be disappointed. I've shot everything out there. I shoot the Glock 20, which is a 10mm round. Its a bit more expensive round than a novice should probably bite off, but its my favorite round. I also have a glock 27 for a carry pistol, which is a 40SW. Its a defense pistol, and is not very range friendly. Its purpose is to save your life.

If you've never really had a lot of shooting experience I suggest a full capacity glock in 40sw over the 9mm. If you ever do to decide to make it a defensive weapon for your home, you'll want the extra bang for the buck. The recoil difference is very small and the cost of ammunition isn't much higher for the 40. The stopping power of the 40 is considerable over a 9mm. The stopping power of my 10mm supercedes that of a .45 with a more manageable recoil.

I shoot 165 grain speer gold dots from doubletapammo.com for a defense round which have the same impact energy of a .41 magnum. The velocity is upwards of 1500 fps and will penetrate autoglass like butter. However, the round is small enough to not overpenetrate a man sized target, putting the energy into the target and not exiting the body.

That's why i prefer a 10mm.

 

[rectifythis]

If the Glock doesn't feel right in your hand (as was my experience) I recommend a Springfield Arms XD sub compact .40 caliber. I have one for concealed carry and love it. It also has a beavertail safety as opposed to the Glock.

 

[Marcos]

Sigarms has lots to choose from as well.

 

[PetersCreek]

What do you guys think about the Glock? Any other suggestions?

Glocks? I like to poke some good-natured fun at the "combat tupperware" shooters but really, I think they're fine weapons. They just don't fit or point well for me. Not a single one of 'em. And I've tried 'em all.

My suggestion: if you have a range in your area that rents pistols, take a trip and try as many as you can. You didn't mention what your experience level is but...if you're not too experienced, you may also consider a familiarization lesson or two while you trying different handguns...or take a trusted friend who's proficient. Finding a firearm that fits you is an important thing and learning about the differences between models from someone who isn't trying to sell you one will help a lot.

I own and have CCWed a full size Kimber 1911 in .45 ACP, an H&K USP Compact .45, and a Kahr PM9 (9mm). The Kimber is my #1. I know the Springfield XD models by reputation and just may add one to the stable one day. I've also fired a couple of the Para-Ordnance LDA models and was favorably impressed.

 

[rectifythis]

What do you guys think about the Glock? Any other suggestions?

Glocks? I like to poke some good-natured fun at the "combat tupperware" shooters but really, I think they're fine weapons. They just don't fit or point well for me. Not a single one of 'em. And I've tried 'em all.

My suggestion: if you have a range in your area that rents pistols, take a trip and try as many as you can. You didn't mention what your experience level is but...if you're not too experienced, you may also consider a familiarization lesson or two while you trying different handguns...or take a trusted friend who's proficient. Finding a firearm that fits you is an important thing and learning about the differences between models from someone who isn't trying to sell you one will help a lot.

I own and have CCWed a full size Kimber 1911 in .45 ACP, an H&K USP Compact .45, and a Kahr PM9 (9mm). The Kimber is my #1. I know the Springfield XD models by reputation and just may add one to the stable one day. I've also fired a couple of the Para-Ordnance LDA models and was favorably impressed.

I also have (and LOVE) the Kimber 1911 .45! I just use the XD for it's size.

 

[smokelaw1]

I also have (and LOVE) the Kimber 1911 .45! I just use the XD for it's size.

Another Kimber 1911 fan here. It's a bit much for me to EDC in what I usually wear, though. If you want a gun that can serve fantastic double duty range gun plus home defense, I honestly can't think of much better.

 

[Michal]

Looks like fun, but... what was that guy behind You doing?

 

[Turk10mm]

I also have (and LOVE) the Kimber 1911 .45! I just use the XD for it's size.

Another Kimber 1911 fan here. It's a bit much for me to EDC in what I usually wear, though. If you want a gun that can serve fantastic double duty range gun plus home defense, I honestly can't think of much better.

i have to disagree with the .45 guys, but that's because I'm a 10mm guy.. The 45 is almost half the velocity of a 10mm, with the 10mm impact energy being far greater than the 45. The recoil is comperable, and my capacity is 15 rounds instead of 7.

Kimber has also grown too big for its britches with too many problems nowadays. The LAPD has even banned Kimber firearms due to malfunctions. The Kimber used to be standard SWAT issue for LAPD. To go from standard issue to banned should say something.

My glock 10mm has fired thousands of rounds. It has never had a firearm malfunction. Not once. I've had some bad rounds that wouldn't discharge, but a Tap Rap Bang resolved those.

The good news is that there are lots of firearms out there. I would suggest a Glock to a novice simply because of ease of use and care. Its bulletproof, doesn't break, simple to operate. It has no inherent "dumbass" safety, which means the safety is in your brain and in your finger. Unless you put your finger on the trigger, it can't go off. It obviously has drop safeties etc, just not a button you have to push to make it go bang.

 

[smokelaw1]

Wow. First I've heard about Kimber having quality problems lately. I have no bought a new Kimber since somewhere around 1999 or 2000. Back then they were still (as far as I know) thought quite highly of.
I've never fired the Glock in 10MM, though a friend of mine has it, and we'll be firing it when I join him at his range sometime. If I could just enjoy shooting a Glock the way I do a 1911, I would make the switch. But at this point, a 1911 feels like an exentsion of my arm, and anythig feels like I have to manhandle it.

 

[jgohlke]

Best advice given so far here: Rent or borrow before you buy. Shoot as many different types of hand guns as you can.

What it feels like in the store and what it feels like at the range don't always match. I think this is particularly important if you don't have much experience. It is easy to over or under buy. I've shopped with a couple of women and they always pick out the snub-nosed 38's. Easy to handle, fits in your purse..what's not to love? Some of them can be downright mean to shoot.

If you are a typical guy, you'll think the Desert Eagle in 50 caliber is just the thing and besides, how cool do you look with it in your hand? Very cool!

Something else to think about that hasn't been mentioned, revolver or semi-automatic? The SA's get all the attention, but my home defense weapon is a plain old revolver. It isn't very glamorous, it ain't too fancy, but I can keep it loaded for years and when I pick it up and pull the trigger, it goes Bang! Come to think of it, I've never had a feed problem with my revolver! (I'm just yanking the chain of the SA fans here...)

Seriously, you can't beat a good double-action revolver, 4" or 6" barrel, .357 (also shoots the very economical 38 special for target practice). You can easily train the whole family how to use it. It's easy to tell when it is loaded and when it isn't. I think a revolver is very good choice as a first handgun. It isn't complicated and you don't have to have an engineering degree to load or clean it.

Buy a good one. It will last forever. They are accurate, inexpensive to shoot and are very capable self-defense weapons.

Down the road, after you have some experience and you still think the whole handgun thing is interesting, buy yourself a nice semi-auto handgun. I have both. Guess which one I pick for a fun day at the range? The revolver.

Here's a true story. Co-workers brother. Develops an interest in guns. I offer some advice (do some research, think revolver I tell him. His wife has that "holding a scorpion" look whenever the gun gets near her. He's buying for home defense and his wife will probably never learn to operate an SA). He buys a 10MM semi-auto. We go shooting a couple of times. He's obviously a novice with poor gun-handling skills. We all managed to not get shot. He shoots it a couple more times and then gets busy with other things. 2 years pass. The gun lays forgotten in the closet. One night he hears a noise in the house. He grabs the unloaded gun and jambs a full clip in (loaded from the last time he want shooting). He remembers to rack the slide. He creeps around the house, doesn't find anything. He comes back up stairs, pops the clip out, tells his wife everything is ok and shoots himself in the left hand, which is still holding the clip. He remembers thinking as he is looking at the "empty" gun, apparently with his finger on the trigger, "I think there is still a bullet in here somewhere".

 

[WhiteAshes]

Major SiG fan here. I carry a P226 in .40. Never had a malfunction with thousands of rounds fired. My g/f carries a Beretta 45FS Cheetah chambered in 9mm short.

Shooting is one of the most fun activities that we enjoy. We've both achieved the NRA Handgun Distinguished Expert rating.

Smokelaw1 hit the nail on the head: The piece has to fit your hand. Moreover, it has to be reliable if you're carrying.

 

[WhiteAshes]

Looks like fun, but... what was that guy behind You doing?

He's holding a shot timer. Competitions are often based on time and accuracy.

 

[Turk10mm]

Looks like fun, but... what was that guy behind You doing?

As Whiteashes said, its a shot timer. The events I was shooting in required shooting multiple targets in different situations. In some instances there were civlians or hostages that had to be defended all under a timed event. There are tactical reloads requiring magazine changes on the fly. Most of the events also call for a draw from the holster.

The timer makes a loud beep when set off by the Range Officer, when you complete your firing and the RO pushes the button again, the timer calculates the time from beep to the very moment of your last shot.

Each man sized target has 3 rings in the body, the center being 0, the next ring being 1, the next ring being 2. If you miss its 5. For every point you get a half a second added to your time. The person with the lowest time at the end of the day wins. There were different shooting evolutions in this shoot.

Here's one of the shoot scenarios.

I shot the stage perfectly, meaning that I hit every target in the 0 center ring, however, I came in 4th in this particular evolution because 3 others did it faster than me, even if they didn't shoot quite as well as I did. Its a combo of speed and accuracy.. This tells me that next time I need to move faster and not concentrate on accuracy quite as much. But overall i came in 3rd at the event, which makes me feel pretty dang good.. It was awesome and challenging.


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CoF 2- Run and Shoot
Course Instructions: Run and shoot

USPSA style
Round count: 19 (or more depending on the shooter)
Instruction: Start at position A with your gun on the table unloaded with a mag next to it. You will be seated in a chair. At the sound of the buzzer you will load your gun and get up from the chair. You will engage the first two targets with two shots each*.
You will then proceed to position B behind cover** and engage the two steel poppers. Hit them until they ping or fall (whichever comes first). You will then move to position C and engage a low angled target with 2 shots. At this point you will need to move to position D and engage the two targets with cover* ** with 2 rounds each. Reload when necessary to finish the remainder of the course. Advance to position E while moving/charging hit each target with 2 rounds each. You will be at position F behind cover** and hit the steel until it pings or falls. That's it.

The object of this course is speed and accuracy.

Notes: This course will require minimum 19 rounds. Unless you miss you will just need 2 mags. If you are limited by capacity, you will need larger mags or borrow some. This course is unlimited.

* = there is no tactical order. Shoot them as you see them.
** = although there is a barricade/cover, it is there as a distraction if you will. You will shoot with cover but you will not be hit with a procedural for having your gun past the barricade/cover within reason or if your body is sticking out more than 50% out. Being "tactical" is not the object of this CoF.

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