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Where Do The "Hints" Of Flavor Come From?

M

McPatrickClan

McPatrickClan
Joined
May 22, 2002
Messages
562
Right off the Cigar Aficionado October 2002 issue:

PAGE 188: Padron Magnum Maduro review states "smoke is floral"
PAGE 188: Arturo Fuente Canones review states "some tangy, cocoa flavors"
PAGE 189: Montecristo A review states "tastes of gum"
PAGE 193: Romeo Y Julieta Churchill review states "notes of citrus"
PAGE 194: Cielo Hercules review states "apples & spice complement the finish"

I have set the stage. Where in the world would these flavors come from? The general separation is between artifically flavored and natural cigars (the common choice for serious cigar smokers). These cigars referred to above would all be considered natural cigars, but I wonder, how natural are the flavors that we taste or see noted in these reviews? Gum? Apple? Did the roller leave a bit of Bubble Yum on his fingers while made the box they tasted?

If these flavors are not introduced artifically, where in the world would they have come from? If they are not introduced by the manufactuer, then the review would be an exercise in futility as the reviewer was imaging these tastes.

I am sincerely puzzled.
???
 
It's their way of trying to make the reviews sound better than "Tastes like tobacco". Taste buds are set up to taste sweet, sour, etc. If they just used the general taste discriptions, the reviews, in their mind, would pretty much all sound the same. Hence the various flavor discriptors.

I saw the cA review on the Fuente Work of Art and they used "hint of coconuts and taste of olive brine"! ???
 
Let me see if I can give an oppinion here:

From all that I have read, and some taste profiles that I have detected on my own. Basically, there is not the taste of Peach in any cigar, unless it is a Peach Flavored Gar (Yuck!). Instead what you would have is a flavor emmitted by one of the leaves in the roll that makes one think about peaches. What I find is that many cigars make me think of certain flavors from my memory banks. I had one once that made me think of Steak, Butter and Worchesteshire (sp). That doesn't mean that those flavors were actually "in" the tobacco. On the other side of the coin, there have been those that were not "complex" in that All that came to mind was tobacco.

Then you have other aspects, such as pepper, spice, leather, etc....
These are flavors I feel do actually exist. Nics and some Hondos are well known for their peppery flavor. This flavour, I believe, comes from the soil, nutrients, and the amount of sun and other aspects of cultivating the tobacco. I find that most of the HDMs that I have found were loaded with a great Leather taste, which I feel most likely is a result of the water's mineral content in the region where those plants used in the construction are grown.

So in summery, some flavors are nothing more than the tricks on ones tastebuds played by the mind. Still others are a result of growing invironment. But whether the taste is really there, or just a figment of our imagination, they are equally enjoyable, or equally trash, depending on the flavor we find.
 
Very good PB, very good. ;) That is a perfect explaination. :thumbs: Well done bro. :)
 
Great points PB!

When you see descriptions such as these in reviews, the reviewer isn't saying that the cigar tastes like orange peel, or hazelnut or whatever. He's saying that the flavor reminds him of these things. It just the suggestion of these flavors. Also, as Shadow said, the taste buds only can taste four things, sour, sweet, salty and canteloupe....no wait, bitter. All the flavors you taste are combinations of these four. But the olfactory senses come into play as well and, while not as refined as a dog's, they are much more sensitive than the tatse buds.

The same thing happens in wine. It's all made from grape juice, but there are flavors of apples (from malic acid), butter (from lactic acid), floral, citrus, leather and hundreds of other "hints" of flavors present in wine.

You have to have something to use as common ground when doing a review; something that the reader of the review can relate to. So flavors that everybody understands are used as a point of reference. The reviewer can't very well say "Has hints of this flavor and subtle touches of that other flavor with a complex ending that reminds me of something." :)
 
FatherTiresius said:
The reviewer can't very well say "Has hints of this flavor and subtle touches of that other flavor with a complex ending that reminds me of something." :)
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And why the heck not, might be more to the point of fact!! :D
 
I try, but to be honest, how "effective" would a review be, if I referred to a flavor of dirty socks in a review of an OpusX?

That is a great cigar, but dirty socks is all I can think of, to describe the prelight smell of the foot. And many wrappers remind me of 2 day old piss, but I doubt I would use that in a review either
 
I try, but to be honest, how "effective" would a review be, if I referred to a flavor of dirty socks in a review of an OpusX?
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My point exactly!

In wine reviews I've seen Cabernet Sauvignons (and French Bordeaux) described as having a flavor like tar. And this was supposed to be a good thing! I regularly see the word "earthy" used in reviews of Pinot Noir (and French Burgundy) and what that word actually refers to is a smell that reminds me of horse poo (sometimes you'll actually see the word "barnyard" used). And, again, this is intended to be flattering.
 
I like profiling taste.....it is, as has already been said, an individual taste or smell by the profiler. We do this quite often in the coffee buisness when we are cupping (a term for tasting coffee). What I taste is not what someone else might taste. Here's a small amount of info about taste. Sorry for the cut and paste. The whole article is very interesting. I will post a link.

tongue2.gif



While there may be a vast array of aroma categories, there are generally considered to be only four primary tastes: bitter, salty, sour, and sweet. These parts of taste are sensed by nerve receptors called buds and there are about 9,000 of them on the average tongue. Combinations of these tastes, along with the accompanying combined aromas, account for different flavors.
Although patterns and concentrations may be highly individualized, specific areas of the tongue are more sensitive to one kind of primary taste than another. Sweet tastes are mainly sensed near the tip. Salt is detected just behind, for about one-third of the tongue. Sour is mainly noticed along the middle fifty percent of the side edges. Bitterness shows up at the back quarter of the tongue, near where it opens to the throat. The center of the tongue contains a mixture of all these specialized taste receptors, but in much lower concentrations.


A Sesory User's Manuel
 
PuroBrat said:
FatherTiresius said:
The reviewer can't very well say "Has hints of this flavor and subtle touches of that other flavor with a complex ending that reminds me of something." :)
Click to expand...
And why the heck not, might be more to the point of fact!! :D
Click to expand...
That's absolutely right. The review contains words like "tastes of gum". This to me, is incredible. He just thinks he tastes gum. It's all mind-games, I guess.
 
The review contains words like "tastes of gum". This to me, is incredible. He just thinks he tastes gum.
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It's not so incredible to me. Some of my favorite cigars have a sweet taste (VSGs for example) and I've more than once tasted mint or eucalyptus in a cigar. Those two together might taste like gum.....or toothpaste. :D :D
 
Well put in your first post Bruddah PB!!!

Now... back to enjoying my 'gar! I just hope I don't encounter hints of "my nuts" :0 :D

Aloha,

Wade
 
Also, they aren't scientific about this either. To be honest to the review, the reviewer would have to eat the same meals at the same time each time they reviewed. Not to mention drinking anything with the cigar. They never tell you any of this.

Emo
 
LOL :D :D

Actually there's nothing wrong with that. As I said, it's considered a Good Thing (tm). It's just not something you'd expect in a wine review.
 
Having been accused of writing for CA on more than one occasion..

That is the exact scent I reffer toas a Barnyard smell.
Leads me to think it will be quite a good smoke.

As to the flavors, I can understand the various explinations on the cigars, but lets face it folks sometimes they get a bit overboard.

I detected a Broccolli type of flavor. (OK yeah right!)

But IN some ole rockets I have tried I could have swore I tasted burn butter or burn popcorn several times.

So It is in perspective.

PB - it is fermented Doinkeypiss and Cow **** but that just wouldn't lend itself to a decent visual and may infact have a few avoiding that brand..

So it is "Barnyard"
 
Well, some of the best cigars I ever puffed on had that rather intoxicating smell to them prior to lighting, but Oh such a lovely scent when burning. A certain '88 ISOM was at the top of said list :D
 
If I can throw my opinion in here too, I can speak that with being in the culinary world for a few years, you can 'train' yourself to pick up the subtley of tastes. Every taste is based off of the salty/sweet/sour range, but with practice, you CAN pick out other flavors. When testing to be a wine snob, you can go and purchase testing vials that contain certain flavors, and you sniff them, to help you down the road when someone asks what the wine tastes like, you can respond with, "light vanilla with a twinge of cherry skins' or something like that.

I know it sounds far fetched, but I firmly believe that after a while, anyone can train themselves to be able to pick that 'slighty floral with a hint of butterscotch' that we all read in each others reviews and the reviews of the 'pro's'. I also agree that whatever you ate and drank before the cigar also plays into the different tastes you can pick up. What I may taste after eating chinese may not be what you might get after eating a steak.
 
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