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An interesting Canadian article

Very very interesting article. If it does indeed start at the factory, kinda makes things tenfold tougher!

Don
 
Nice find Wilkey. I find it hard to believe that a counterfeit box could sell for as much as $2000, but I'm also not aware how much the average box sells for in Canada.
 
One could look up Havana House and find a list of retailers. But I suspect that the list is not complete with respect to B&Ms that sell authentic Habanos or shops that conduct online sales and that claim they are supplied by Havana House. Especially the latter.

As far as cigars costing up to $2,000 per box, perhaps our Canadian brothers could chime in but that's not inconsistent with the prices I saw in a shop up in VC a few months ago. $50-60 or higher per for a high end stick was not uncommon. I can imagine what EL's and such might cost. And it's not just Habanos either. If you saw what you'd have to pay for Fuente, Padron, etc., it'd put you off smoking for good.

Wilkey
 
Thanks for yet another very enlightening piece of info. It sure is a really eye opener to think that fakes maybe leaving the factory mix with originals. I would be interested to know how many from the box were fakes compared to the number of authentic.

Thanks again Wilkey

Brandon
 
Ginseng said:
One could look up Havana House and find a list of retailers. But I suspect that the list is not complete with respect to B&Ms that sell authentic Habanos or shops that conduct online sales and that claim they are supplied by Havana House. Especially the latter.

As far as cigars costing up to $2,000 per box, perhaps our Canadian brothers could chime in but that's not inconsistent with the prices I saw in a shop up in VC a few months ago. $50-60 or higher per for a high end stick was not uncommon. I can imagine what EL's and such might cost. And it's not just Habanos either. If you saw what you'd have to pay for Fuente, Padron, etc., it'd put you off smoking for good.

Wilkey
Click to expand...

Very true. $2000/box is not at all uncommon. Although I don't think I have ever seen a "box" price in a local B&M. When I was in one I asked about a box discount on a cab of Canadian REs and they said no, just the stick price. $32*50 is a bit pricey.

In Calgary, I have heard rumors of an authorized Havana House of Canada retailler refilling boxes with the Havana House label with questionable cigars that his customers or himself brings back from Cuba/Mexico, etc.

In either event, I don't find it uncommon to find fakes in B&Ms. There are only a handful of locals that I have been to that I actually trust.
 
Pretty sad state of affairs when your countries B&M's sell fakes. This is not a third world country.

Brian
 
drew_goring said:
In Calgary, I have heard rumors of an authorized Havana House of Canada retailler refilling boxes with the Havana House label with questionable cigars that his customers or himself brings back from Cuba/Mexico, etc.

In either event, I don't find it uncommon to find fakes in B&Ms. There are only a handful of locals that I have been to that I actually trust.
Click to expand...
Holy cow. That's pretty shocking, Drew. Truly, buyer beware and know thy dealer.

Wilkey
 
It seems that this article is from Nov 1997. Would one believe that the counterfeiting has gotten worse? Clearly, you have got to use trusted sources and the local B&M isn't usually going to be one of them.
 
LouieD said:
It seems that this article is from Nov 1997. Would one believe that the counterfeiting has gotten worse? Clearly, you have got to use trusted sources and the local B&M isn't usually going to be one of them.
Click to expand...
Good question. In light of Drew's comments and my own experience with Canada-based stores that have dealt counterfeits, if it's gotten any better, it ain't a whole lot better. I'd hazard a guess that it's probably gotten worse. That would be in keeping with situations here in the USA and abroad.

Wilkey
 
Can you imagine what will happen here when the Cuban Import ban is lifted :laugh: :laugh: ! Holy Crap... we will be inundated with fakes. People will be in their backyards rolling lettuce leafs and peddling the junk to the local B&Ms as legit Cubans.
 
LouieD said:
Can you imagine what will happen here when the Cuban Import ban is lifted :laugh: :laugh: ! Holy Crap... we will be inundated with fakes. People will be in their backyards rolling lettuce leafs and peddling the junk to the local B&Ms as legit Cubans.
Click to expand...
Yeah. It's going to be a free for all and there won't be a thing that Habanos S.A. or Altadis can do about it. Oh, they'll try. They'll have to. But at least in the beginning, it's going to be like trying to stop people from downloading ripped music or movies.

The thing to watch for is what the "established" online vendors of counterfeits will do. It gives me the willies just thinking about how many greenbacks are going to be thrown at crapola.

Wilkey
 
Simones
Length: 5
Ring: 48
Hand Rolled
Box of 50 $979.00

canadian re price...i dont buy more than a handful of cigars in canada on any given year.
so...fakes...i dont know.
esplendido prices...i dont relly know...never desired any at can$ so i have never inquired...but 2000$ doesnt seem to far off.

derrek
 
dvickery said:
Simones
Length: 5
Ring: 48
Hand Rolled
Box of 50 $979.00

canadian re price...i dont buy more than a handful of cigars in canada on any given year.
so...fakes...i dont know.
esplendido prices...i dont relly know...never desired any at can$ so i have never inquired...but 2000$ doesnt seem to far off.

derrek
Click to expand...

Definitely wondering where that cab is if you don't mind PMing me. :thumbs:
 
Interesting article Wilkey, thanks for sharing...

being from Toronto I can chime in here about pricing - Yes I have seen prices around the $2000.00 CAD mark for Cuban cigars. This was for Cohiba Double Corona LTD 2003 at a well established/famous B&M - whose clientele consist of an endless parade of the rich and famous from the world over. For Esplendidos $1400.00 CAD, Rubustos $900.00 CAD (or 37.00 for singles) and Siglo VI's $1300.00 CAD (55.00 each).

I recently vacationed in Cuba and a friend asked me at the last moment to bring back Esplendidos for him. That box cost me 498 CUC (approx 567 CAD) at The Casa Del Habanos - I knew enough to stay well away from sweet deals I was offered everywhere on the street. Being a cigar virgin I was not sure of the pricing and found it "expensive"- so for myself I picked up some Siglos, Rubustos, and Magicos. A long story short, when I came back I was astounded by the prices in Toronto - The Siglo VI Tubos I paid 22.00 was going for 65.00 .. Everything here is at least 3x the cost in Cuba and my friend tells me I have our insane Tobacco tax laws to thank for that. Man I am still kicking myself for not buying boxes instead of a few singles.

I expect to travel to Cuba again in the near future (not to mention that it isn't common to have someone from my immediate family going there in the winter months ) and I will certainly be requesting/bringing back entire boxes of my favorites. So I started looking for the best/safest B&M in Toronto to obtain singles to decide what I like. I was surprised to learn that there is but a handful of B&M that other Torontonian cigar Aficionados would recommend. I have decided that I would pay the $2.00 - $6.00 premium over the cheaper B&Ms and only buy from the top one who seems to have quite a strong relationship with Havana House and not to mention their reputation at stake with their well heeled clientele.

What about you guys? What is your experience with buying your cigars online and your local B&Ms?
P.S. I have been paying special attention to the articles and threads on fake Cohibas 
 
Interesting article, Wilkey. It reminds us to be ever vigilent.

Rdef1...I, unfortunately, am unable to opine regarding B&M prices of Cuban cigars as I live in the US. :(
 
Rdef1 said:
Interesting article Wilkey, thanks for sharing...

being from Toronto I can chime in here about pricing - Yes I have seen prices around the $2000.00 CAD mark for Cuban cigars. This was for Cohiba Double Corona LTD 2003 at a well established/famous B&M - whose clientele consist of an endless parade of the rich and famous from the world over. For Esplendidos $1400.00 CAD, Rubustos $900.00 CAD (or 37.00 for singles) and Siglo VI's $1300.00 CAD (55.00 each).

I recently vacationed in Cuba and a friend asked me at the last moment to bring back Esplendidos for him. That box cost me 498 CUC (approx 567 CAD) at The Casa Del Habanos - I knew enough to stay well away from sweet deals I was offered everywhere on the street. Being a cigar virgin I was not sure of the pricing and found it "expensive"- so for myself I picked up some Siglos, Rubustos, and Magicos. A long story short, when I came back I was astounded by the prices in Toronto - The Siglo VI Tubos I paid 22.00 was going for 65.00 .. Everything here is at least 3x the cost in Cuba and my friend tells me I have our insane Tobacco tax laws to thank for that. Man I am still kicking myself for not buying boxes instead of a few singles.

I expect to travel to Cuba again in the near future (not to mention that it isn't common to have someone from my immediate family going there in the winter months ) and I will certainly be requesting/bringing back entire boxes of my favorites. So I started looking for the best/safest B&M in Toronto to obtain singles to decide what I like. I was surprised to learn that there is but a handful of B&M that other Torontonian cigar Aficionados would recommend. I have decided that I would pay the $2.00 - $6.00 premium over the cheaper B&Ms and only buy from the top one who seems to have quite a strong relationship with Havana House and not to mention their reputation at stake with their well heeled clientele.

What about you guys? What is your experience with buying your cigars online and your local B&Ms?
P.S. I have been paying special attention to the articles and threads on fake Cohibas 
Click to expand...
Rdef1,

Thank you for the great post and for sharing your experience. I was recently in Vancouver at a lounge/shop there and was just boggled by the prices. The approach taken by Canadians who frequent these establishments was to buy and try at the shops, but also to purchase a box now and then to insure exceptional treatment in their lounge. But alas, with the recent passage of the smoking ban, their very comfy lounge has been shut down and their experienced and friendly servers are now little more than counter help. What a tragedy.

It's quite surprising to me that even with an official distributor, that so many shops offer fakes. I remember walking down the main streets in VC and seeing the glowing neon signs advertising "Cuban Cigars" and wondering what they were really selling. Some of these shops struck me as headshops, or even 7-Eleven type convenience stores.

With respect to online v B&M, here in the U.S. it is much the same. Buy to try and then order boxes from any one of the reputable vendors here such as Al at Puffstuff, Mark at Tower, Brad at The Outlaw.

Wilkey
 
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