I think I passed a fake

[opusXmarco]

You're a good man Jeff...no matter what Jonesy and the others say.

 

[Bsneed51]

Jeff passed a fake, and apparently Phil's pass is a fake so who knows what is really going on around here. :sign:

 

[Charley]

Charley got back to me and confirmed that he has the cigar. I am sending him some fake White Owls as a replacement and instructed him to give the EL 04 to his brother in law

. AT least the fake White Owls will taste and smoke the same as the legit ones.

YES! SCORE!!!

Hey......do those White Owls come in Tutti Frutti...?

 

[tomthirtysix]

Charley got back to me and confirmed that he has the cigar. I am sending him some fake White Owls as a replacement and instructed him to give the EL 04 to his brother in law

. AT least the fake White Owls will taste and smoke the same as the legit ones.

YES! SCORE!!!

Hey......do those White Owls come in Tutti Frutti...?

Jeff is sending them, what do you think? :laugh:

 

[CigarStone]

You're a good man Jeff...no matter what Jonesy and the others say.

Damnit!

I honestly thought I would get through life without anyone saying anything bad about me!

Damnit!

 

[dagoR6]

I don't want to point this at someone who isn't here to defend themselves when in fact, I don't know for sure what I sent to him. This was my fault regardless of what I was told by someone else.

I know. I commend your taking responsibility, I'd expect nothing less from you, Jeff. You're a stand up guy. It always come back to he who passed it, no matter what.

I'm just saying that it would be pretty bad if someone with knowledge and experience that was being mined for 100% authentication in many cases missed something like that. I don't think anyone who is not here needs to defend anything. It just goes to show that relying on the experience of others, no matter their reputation, is not a 100% situation.

That "stick verifier" in question is newer to CC's than I would imagine many people on this forum. He mapped his passion and intellect to the process of finding fakes at a prodigious rate. To take him as an absolute authority on the subject is silly. Jeff's experience with these fakes (which may not be fakes anyway IMHO) just exposes two basics with passing/selling/buying CC's:

1) It's extremely tough to tell if they are fakes
2) Sometimes real cuban cigars have all sorts of production problems that would scream fake to half the "inspectors" we see on these forums.
3) It's tough to trade/pass/sell sticks because they could be fake (despite best effort) and worse the receiver might think they are fakes even when they are in fact real.

I think it's awesome you're taking advantage of the forum to get out there and say possible mea-culpa and you'd like to make it right. A great sign that this is in fact a community.

 

[StinkiMonki]

I can't believe you passed a fake. That, sir, is crazy behavior! Even for a hairless nut lover like yourself. LOL

Still hope to see you in the Rose Bowl this year. There is still some hope left.

Stinki

 

[insight]

BURN THE WITCH!

 

[tone-ny]

I don't want to point this at someone who isn't here to defend themselves when in fact, I don't know for sure what I sent to him. This was my fault regardless of what I was told by someone else.

I know. I commend your taking responsibility, I'd expect nothing less from you, Jeff. You're a stand up guy. It always come back to he who passed it, no matter what.

I'm just saying that it would be pretty bad if someone with knowledge and experience that was being mined for 100% authentication in many cases missed something like that. I don't think anyone who is not here needs to defend anything. It just goes to show that relying on the experience of others, no matter their reputation, is not a 100% situation.

That "stick verifier" in question is newer to CC's than I would imagine many people on this forum. He mapped his passion and intellect to the process of finding fakes at a prodigious rate. To take him as an absolute authority on the subject is silly. Jeff's experience with these fakes (which may not be fakes anyway IMHO) just exposes two basics with passing/selling/buying CC's:

The stick verifier has examined many cigars over the years! He has photographed many a bogus cigar and explained what was wrong. Just because he erred here doesn't mean he doesn't know what he is talking about. I'm sure many of the folks here that are long term habano smokers have had a bogus cigar or two over the years.

That we are talking about Cohiba is the story at hand! The most counterfeited marca in the world. ELs of the Cohiba marca are the most sought after and in my opinion. I made a bet that quite a few of you have fake Cohiba ELs in your stash/collections.

I know for a fact I have 3 bogus Cohiba Sublime ELs. I would bet 90% of the people here would have a hard time seeing the issues with any of those three cigars. Plus I have plenty of cigars that people have sent me over the years that were hinky and they didn’t know.

Bottom line was CS thought he had an issue with a cigar and he asked and sought verification. Based on the information he received he let community know and it was taken out of circulation.

 

[Yeahthatsme]

I would agree there Tony, Cohibos are definitely the biggest risk when you're trading/selling/bombing cubans.

 

[grateful1]

I don't want to point this at someone who isn't here to defend themselves when in fact, I don't know for sure what I sent to him. This was my fault regardless of what I was told by someone else.

I know. I commend your taking responsibility, I'd expect nothing less from you, Jeff. You're a stand up guy. It always come back to he who passed it, no matter what.

I'm just saying that it would be pretty bad if someone with knowledge and experience that was being mined for 100% authentication in many cases missed something like that. I don't think anyone who is not here needs to defend anything. It just goes to show that relying on the experience of others, no matter their reputation, is not a 100% situation.

That "stick verifier" in question is newer to CC's than I would imagine many people on this forum. He mapped his passion and intellect to the process of finding fakes at a prodigious rate. To take him as an absolute authority on the subject is silly. Jeff's experience with these fakes (which may not be fakes anyway IMHO) just exposes two basics with passing/selling/buying CC's:

1) It's extremely tough to tell if they are fakes
2) Sometimes real cuban cigars have all sorts of production problems that would scream fake to half the "inspectors" we see on these forums.
3) It's tough to trade/pass/sell sticks because they could be fake (despite best effort) and worse the receiver might think they are fakes even when they are in fact real.

I think it's awesome you're taking advantage of the forum to get out there and say possible mea-culpa and you'd like to make it right. A great sign that this is in fact a community.

???

I was told there would be no maths!

 

[CigarStone]

Let me say this again......this is not about Wilkey in any way, shape, or form! I honestly don't even know if the EL I sent to Wilkey came from the same purchase as the ones I have since discovered to be fakes.

The sad part of this is that I thought I had some incredible cigars which I could smoke on special occasions and now may never even be able to smoke a real one. The ones I have smoked have either tasted horrible or tasted okay but had severe burn issues, I'm assuming they were all fakes!

 

[Bsneed51]

Let me say this again......this is not about Wilkey in any way, shape, or form! I honestly don't even know if the EL I sent to Wilkey came from the same purchase as the ones I have since discovered to be fakes.

The way I've read this is that no one was necessarily condemning Wilkey, it was more a commentary on the fact that even someone who is really good at spotting fakes can get fooled, so always be careful with CC's, especially Cohibas. Hopefully at some point you get the chance to enjoy a real one of these.

 

[dagoR6]

Let me say this again......this is not about Wilkey in any way, shape, or form! I honestly don't even know if the EL I sent to Wilkey came from the same purchase as the ones I have since discovered to be fakes.

The way I've read this is that no one was necessarily condemning Wilkey, it was more a commentary on the fact that even someone who is really good at spotting fakes can get fooled, so always be careful with CC's, especially Cohibas. Hopefully at some point you get the chance to enjoy a real one of these.

That's exactly what my point is in fact. I'm not calling Wilkey an idiot, only pointing out that in fact he's not an end all expert on identifying fakes which is in fact a very difficult task. If you or anyone gets fooled by a fake, there's no shame in it at all. It's just very difficult to tell in a time when nationalization has crossed with slip-shod QA to yield real sticks that seem fake and vice versa. This is why the FOG's constantly hammer home "know your source" as the only way to know for sure. I'd like to say again, I think this is an amazing community because the vast majority acts with great and honest intentions and the remainders get hammered on immediately. Kudos to CigarStone again.

Just for an example of how difficult it is, here's a picture from cuban cigar website, from Jay's gallery, of a box of Punch's. Looks like a very rare diademas extra to me, but look at the variety of lengths, something that most people would call "fake".

 

[Charley]

First off I would like to thank Jeff for letting me (as well as all of us) know that this stick was a suspected fake. I also want to thank him for the "over the top" (WAY over the top) replacement package that he sent out to me. I decided that I would smoke this stick to see if it was, in fact, a fake. Now I am nowhere near an expert on the subject so I will just report what I experienced.

First off, on close inspection the wrapper seemed to have differing shades to it. But the overall construction was not bad (to my untrained eye anyway). The cigar had a somewhat musty, tabacco smell to it. I clipped it and checked the draw whitch was ok but the unlit flavor was very mild. I torched the foot and began smoking it and it was very bland with just a mild tabacco flavor. I smoked it about an inch down and decided that was enough as the flavor just was not very good.

I clipped off the burnt end, slit the cigar open and proceeded to open it up. Here are some photos of what it looked like:

http://s894.photobuc...%20Cohiba%20EL/

I have some more photos if anyone is intersted, just drop me a message and I'll get them to you.

 

[CigarStone]

Glad you got em Charley and I hope you enjoy!

Thanks for taking the time to smoke it and thanks for the pics.

I can't believe you passed a fake. That, sir, is crazy behavior! Even for a hairless nut lover like yourself. LOL

Still hope to see you in the Rose Bowl this year. There is still some hope left.

Stinki

That, sir, would be a pleasure! I could use a trip west!