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SCHIP Update

NorcalMark

New Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2005
Messages
723
This was just sent to me in an email.

SCHIP Likely to Pass in Early 2009
Confidence High that Industry Compromise will be Incorporated into Legislation


January 8, 2008 - As the U.S. Congress returned to work the first week of January and with the pending inauguration of President-Elect Barack Obama, news reports, editorials, rumors, both substantiated and unsubstantiated related to SCHIP are circulating through the media, online, and phone calls.

One important fact must be addressed now-the rumor of the floor tax is false. The IPCPR and the Cigar Association of America (CAA) worked diligently to get the floor tax on large cigars removed early on in the beginning days of the SCHIP fight-in Summer of 2007. It has not been reinstated.

In the next few days, we will have a legitimate idea of when SCHIP will again begin moving through the legislative process on Capitol Hill. This formal process could start as early as the week of January 12.

It is important to keep in mind that there is a high level of confidence that the compromise agreed to by the IPCPR and the CAA, and accepted by key congressional members, will be implemented into the SCHIP bill. Since last summer, both organizations have and continue to meet with key congressional staffers and congress members to ensure the industry compromise will become a part of SCHIP. Unfortunately, do to the sensitivity of this compromise, and the fact that it has not yet officially introduced into the legislation, we are unwilling to share the details with the general membership or public.

Once the compromise is introduced and amended into the 2009 SCHIP bill, we will share these important details. Until then, please know that your Executive Board, executive director, IPCPR's federal lobbyists, and the CAA and their lobbyists have, and continue to work to protect the industry's interests and your businesses.

Thank you for your understanding and continued support.


International Premium Cigar & Pipe Retailers Association (IPCPR)
Chris McCalla
Legislative Director
 
It is important to keep in mind that there is a high level of confidence that the compromise agreed to by the IPCPR and the CAA, and accepted by key congressional members, will be implemented into the SCHIP bill. Since last summer, both organizations have and continue to meet with key congressional staffers and congress members to ensure the industry compromise will become a part of SCHIP. Unfortunately, do to the sensitivity of this compromise, and the fact that it has not yet officially introduced into the legislation, we are unwilling to share the details with the general membership or public.

International Premium Cigar & Pipe Retailers Association (IPCPR)
Chris McCalla
Legislative Director

So, our feedback doesn't mean anything and we should all just sit back and wait for the 'surprise'. I think this is b.s.
 
Sounds like they made a back-room deal that they don't want the membership to know about, because when they find out they'll flip out and stop sending money.

Doc.
 
Sounds like they made a back-room deal that they don't want the membership to know about, because when they find out they'll flip out and stop sending money.

Doc.

It very well could be Doc.

For now I am going with...they made the best deal they could. Hopefully it's a sweet deal for us.

If not, it's time to do something else!
 
Sounds like they made a back-room deal that they don't want the membership to know about, because when they find out they'll flip out and stop sending money.

Doc.
That's exactly what I was thinking as I read that memo. But then again, if they pass this in it's current form, that's going to seriously cripple the IPCPR's credibility.

But the obvious flaw still remains...if they raise the taxes so high that hardly anyone purchases tobacco products anymore, what hope do they have to fund this Child Health Care Program. If these and other products don't produce the estimated revenue, this thing goes broke in 6-12 months. Then the money has to come from another source, higher taxes in other areas.

So it seems this is just a backhanded way of killing the tobacco industry once and for all....or at the very least, bringing it to it's knees.
 
I'm starting to sense a certain stigma that retailers might be milking to the last drop. I've noticed a lot of "sell-offs" and "buy now, before it's too late!" sales campaigns. I think there may a certain aspect of "prepare for the worst" syndrome, but at the same time I'm seeing a lot of rehashing of old news, MAYBE in attempt to keep up the public awareness...but at the same time I'm starting to see retailers taking advantage of the hype.
 
So what is this going to do to our favorite guys out there running B&M's? I do a lot of shopping online but I do go to the B&M occasionally just for support & spend a little coin.

Mark?
 
I'm starting to sense a certain stigma that retailers might be milking to the last drop. I've noticed a lot of "sell-offs" and "buy now, before it's too late!" sales campaigns. I think there may a certain aspect of "prepare for the worst" syndrome, but at the same time I'm seeing a lot of rehashing of old news, MAYBE in attempt to keep up the public awareness...but at the same time I'm starting to see retailers taking advantage of the hype.
Same as the gun dealers have done with the rise of the Dems. They pretend they're looking out for you, but in reality they're out to line their pockets with the money of the panicked.

Doc.
 
Sounds like they made a back-room deal that they don't want the membership to know about, because when they find out they'll flip out and stop sending money.

Doc.
That's exactly what I was thinking as I read that memo. But then again, if they pass this in it's current form, that's going to seriously cripple the IPCPR's credibility.

But the obvious flaw still remains...if they raise the taxes so high that hardly anyone purchases tobacco products anymore, what hope do they have to fund this Child Health Care Program. If these and other products don't produce the estimated revenue, this thing goes broke in 6-12 months. Then the money has to come from another source, higher taxes in other areas.

So it seems this is just a backhanded way of killing the tobacco industry once and for all....or at the very least, bringing it to it's knees.

It isn't backhanded. It is deliberate and what the US has legally promised to do.

The US president (or designate) signed the treaty on Tobacco control (WHO FCTC for googling) in 2004. By signing, the US pledged to implement "price and tax measures to reduce the demand for tobacco" (among a whole bunch of other stuff on labeling, public smoking, etc.). I realize that the US has not ratified the treaty, but the US isn't big on ratifying treaties (a whole 'nother topic). (Int'l legal non-lesson: 'Signing' means we promise to follow the treaty, but we aren't promising when. Ratification means that the country promises when the treaty will be fully in force, and the country agrees to be penalized for non-compliance.)
 
So what is this going to do to our favorite guys out there running B&M's? I do a lot of shopping online but I do go to the B&M occasionally just for support & spend a little coin.

Mark?


Hey Rob,

The sad thing is that is will affect everyone trying to sell cigars. The tax is pretty much collected at the wholesale level. The manufactures pay it. It's built into the wholesale cost of the item when it is sold to the B&M's. There is no why to avoid the Fed tax.

So I have to pay it, the b&m around the block from your house has to pay it, JR has to pay it, Holts.

IPCPR and the CAA are trying to keep the tax increase to a minimum. SCHIP is going to be passed just how much the tax is going to increase, we won't know that for a bit.
 
It will be interesting to see. If the tax does greatly impact sales, how long will it take for someone to set up an on line retail store off shore. Say in a country that has little to no tobacco taxes. If shipping costs can be kept lower than what the tax (federal and state) would be. :whistling:
 
But the obvious flaw still remains...if they raise the taxes so high that hardly anyone purchases tobacco products anymore, what hope do they have to fund this Child Health Care Program. If these and other products don't produce the estimated revenue, this thing goes broke in 6-12 months. Then the money has to come from another source, higher taxes in other areas.

I don't think they care if the funding dries up in a year or so. By that time people will be sold on the idea of the care being provided that they'll be perfectly willing to fund it with some other tax. Using tobacco as the "gateway funding instrument" is an easy way to get people to make a greater sacrifice. Incremental steps are what it takes to make drastic changes.
 
It will be interesting to see. If the tax does greatly impact sales, how long will it take for someone to set up an on line retail store off shore. Say in a country that has little to no tobacco taxes. If shipping costs can be kept lower than what the tax (federal and state) would be. :whistling:
This won't take very long thanks to capitalism, but there will be a risk of the products getting seized in shipping(albeit unlikely) or ruined in shipping {at least during the summer}. Also with CP, we can share bulk orders among ourselves to reduce the impact of shipping.

But yes, you're B&Ms probably will get killed if the taxes are high enough.
 
It will be interesting to see. If the tax does greatly impact sales, how long will it take for someone to set up an on line retail store off shore. Say in a country that has little to no tobacco taxes. If shipping costs can be kept lower than what the tax (federal and state) would be. :whistling:
This won't take very long thanks to capitalism, but there will be a risk of the products getting seized in shipping(albeit unlikely) or ruined in shipping {at least during the summer}. Also with CP, we can share bulk orders among ourselves to reduce the impact of shipping.

But yes, you're B&Ms probably will get killed if the taxes are high enough.

That's the unfortunate part. The people who worked hard to build their business will be hurt the most.

Edit because I can't type.
 
The rumored amount from what I've been hearing is $.40 per stick. If this goes through at that rate, it may put a dent in some already struggling shops, but in the end, all of us who smoke on a regular basis will likely continue to buy cigars at the same pace. If your favorite cigar costs $6 and now it's ~$6.60, is that really going to stop you from buying that cigar? I think you'll be surprised that while some may say yes. In the end, they'll likely still buy that cigar and if they don't then they'll continue to buy cigars, but instead of buying that original cigar that was $6, maybe now they're buying a cigar that's $4.50.

Then again, that's assuming that the tax is $.40
 
I am not sure why we even need a SCHIP plan in the first place.

If we can GIVE AWAY health care to ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS, why can we not do the same for our citizens?

Tim
 
I am not sure why we even need a SCHIP plan in the first place.

If we can GIVE AWAY health care to ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS, why can we not do the same for our citizens?

Tim

Don't even get me started!
 
Yes don't get me started either. Read my sig line to tell how I feel about all this bullshit...

Ery
 
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