A Must Read Thread

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also posted in the other thread.

Sam politely made me aware of this travesty. Thanks Sam.

I haven't mailed my part of the winnings yet.

:angry: Now...

First. List everyones name and what they sent. If you don't feel that you can post it, send the names to me and I will post them for you.

This is a disgrace.

The rules were plainly stated before anyone joined up. Hell! They were stated before I joined up.

I count five sticks on the list that would be considered High End.

You people need to make this right. Whoever you are!

This brings me to another topic on these same lines. I have recently decided to take a little break from CP because I simply have too many irons in the fire at other places. I have still been in touch with a few of the people here that I have became friends with. However comma! I left the lottos and other blind trades just because of bull**** like this. We are adults here. As I have said before, if you can't or won't pay, don't play!

I am still relatively new here but even during my short stay, this place has gone down hill (no offense to you Rod) because of a select few who can't seem to play by the 'unspoken' rules.

Question: Who left first... the morality or the FOG's?

Congrats to our winner. Best of luck to you. Work it out the best way you can. Happy Trails.
 
Ok people I sat there this morning listening to all the BS running rampant in the chat room about the lottery and who sent what and so on ...............

Well I can take credit for cigars #
8 Cohiba Churchill *
9 Rosa Cuba (2)
10 CAO Anniversaire *
11 Mayorga HO Maduro
12 Mayorga HO EMS
13 CAO Criollo *
14 Masterblend Limited production *
15 Olivio

and a OneOff either a robusto or a corona gordo *

The 5 marked with *'s I sent in to cover the lotto the few others where just something new to try, I wasnt thinking volume I truly beleaved that the 5 I picked out and ?ed others about would cover the 2 stix
Anyways it has been brought to my attention that I fell short of the msrp by 1 so to make things right with BatChief and to make peace with the Brotherhood.
I ask BatChief to name the cigar and I will make good on it so all will be right in our domain once more ...........................................humbly Roseysamn
 
Ok, I have been dealing with Darin for a couple of weeks now and I don’t think he will mind me saying that he is a true rookie to cigars. He is very new to our world of cigars, he has not asked my opinion on anything he has received yet, nor has he complained about anything he has received yet. So I think that the fact that he has received these cigars as winnings is wrong, but we also don’t know if some of these cigars were sent as extras to the originally stated winnings! If the were not {and you know who you are that sent them} I would think that that is a piss poor way to treat a brother! This was stated in one other Lottery “If you don’t have the stock to play, don’t get involved!” I’m sure you would not like to get screwed if you won! :sneaky:
 
What I also see as a problem here is. A few people make friends and feel they are treated proper by a BoTL. Then they take that as par for trading and passing. Others have experienced alot more class from BoTL and in turn, they see this as par. It is evedent that there is definately a communication problem due to the massive influx of new members. This I believe is not intentional by all new members, but some I believe are true villans and scam artists. Some are just that... New. And they do desrve to learn without fear of being shunned. But you can easily tell these people by their responses when they are called out by an elder or just more experienced and knowlegeable member.
But let me explain a trick that will and has caused problems. The New member joining starts by gifting and making fair and comendable trades, passes, what have you. These people are just coiling for the strike, and after they do, the members that have got a good trade from the snakes stand up and want to cry foul when the snake( who treated them good) are called out. This in turn causes the elders ( as I will call them ) to say ok fine have it your way. Non the less it continues and the family here suffers. It also causes paranoia! A few of us still stand up and look out for the new members, but after a while the respect that should be shown goes out the window. The FOG's then just start keeping to themselves and the tried and true BoTL. As with any growing community, there are going to be arguments and disagreements between members, not all are worth posting on. Some are just personality clashes. But when it comes to being fair and teaching edicate (sp?) there is no room for tolerence of disrespect.
Now for the reason I started blowing my horn again!
I feel some disrespect was shown to Sam. He was just trying to help. If there was a misunderstanding by him, or he missed a fact or two, he still deserved a respectful avenue of approach. Which wasn't shown, and again this has caused someone who has the best interest of CP at heart to throw there hands up. Now, If I've missed something about Sam that says I wrong, then Shout it out to me... because I like it that way. I'll appologize if I'm wrong to the whole planet. But if I feel in the right, I'll agrivate you all to death with my posts.
 
??? Just my humble opinion

I am very new to cigars and to cp. First I want to say I think cp is a wonderfull sight and that everyone here has made me feal more than welcome, If I ever had a question someone was allways there to help me out.

As a newbie it makes me feal good knowing that there are FOGs out there looking out for the integrity of of cp and its members. I also know it is very easy for someone to get there fealings hurt, no one likes to be told they messed up even if it was unintentional, as I think was the case today, but still it needed to be brought to there attention. Hopefully fealings and friendships can be mended. I believe our main concerns should be to keep cp in the spirit for which it was founded "again in my opinion" to further the knowledge and enjoyment of cigars and to form new bonds and friendships in the prosess, oh yes AND TO HAVE FUN WHILE DOING IT if possible, sorry couldnt resist the last one :p . I for one have no problem with someone jumping in and correcting me if I mess up , this post included, hope im not oversteping my bounds being a newbie.

Ive also heard several people talking about makeing there passes invite only. Being fairly new here myself I hope it doesnt come to this as Im on the sight alot reading but dont post that often I think this is post # 100 :0 in 2 months Ive done a few box splits but havent gotten to know anyone that well (all my falt for not talking more , chat room included) at this rate it would take forever for me to get an invite.

I guess what im trying to say is Sam and all others dont back off a bit , your keeping this sight a safe place to play for all :D :D :D

Thanks for your time
Randy
 
Regulation is needed for the well-being of the site... no doubt. However, we don't want to get into a holding pattern where it becomes hostile for newbies to learn the ropes. The reason I (and many others) are still here today is because of the warm welcome we received in the beginning. We were given a chance to learn. On the flipside, we also strived to make sure we didn't step on anyone's toes... especially a FOGs, cuz you know... with old age and all, they might lose a toe or three. :)

We're all here to have fun. I think in the light of things, that's slowly being forgotten. Let's try to keep it fun. Everyone looks out for everyone else. If there really is a troll or scammer, then like a big brother... we'll beat the tar out of them. :D
 
You know I don't weigh in on stuff all that often. All you have to do is look at my posts compared to my member number to see that, lost posts in the past or not. It really has been a shame though to see so many people getting bent out of shape over just cigars. You know my old saying, "Cigars Are Fun."

One of the problems seems to me to be that we are communicating on a board through the written form and it can be difficult to get nuances accross to others in our writing. So much of human expresion is facial expressions, vocal tone, body language and such. As Randy says though it is very easy to get feelings hurt without all the additional input we are used to in day to day conversations.

I myself have to be very careful of this. I personally use sarcasm a great deal in my usual conversations. It's quite well known to most that know me. This is very hard to express in writing though so I have to be careful to avoid this when comunicating in print. I had to learn this the hard way I'm afraid. I worked for a while at a job that was very stressful and the different shift communicated and passed along a great deal of info through a communication log. You think it's easy to step on someones toes with a fun subject like cigars?? Try it in a high stress job!

Now I am in no way singling anyone out, or accusing anyone of anything. I also know that a lot of whats seen on the threads after things boil over is just the end result of something that probably started in PM's with a much different tone at that time. The thing I used to try and do when at work was refrain from responding to an entry that pissed me off until towords the end of my shift rather then right as I walked in and first started reading. That way I would have a whole shift to think, relax, learn more details elswhere, perhaps talk to the person in person, or at the very least be a whole lot more tired when I finally did sit down to write and be too tired to be as upset.

The thing to do above all else though is try to remember that Cigars Are Fun, and that extra care and thought should to be taken when saying something in print rather then the way we would say things in person. Hopefully this will keep toes from being stepped on and keep the defensive reactions and over reactions to a minimum.

Just my 2 cents worth, I could be way off base and out of line here. Please rember also I am in no way accusing anyone of anything.

Cigars Are Fun!!
 
I feel some disrespect was shown to Sam. He was just trying to help. If there was a misunderstanding by him, or he missed a fact or two, he still deserved a respectful avenue of approach. Which wasn't shown, and again this has caused someone who has the best interest of CP at heart to throw there hands up. Now, If I've missed something about Sam that says I wrong, then Shout it out to me... because I like it that way. I'll appologize if I'm wrong to the whole planet. But if I feel in the right, I'll agrivate you all to death with my posts.
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Well, guilty as charged of showing disrespect to Sam. This is a case where I felt I know him well enough (and SD_Stack and Fast4Dr as well for that matter) so that I can take a little liberty and get "fresh" with the three of them, that's the reason I put the :love: icon in there. Just the same, cohibasurfer makes a good point so maybe I went too far? I honestly do not think that any of them are upset with me and if any of you are then please accept my apologies.

I consider Sam to be one of my best buds here and I'm confident he knows that I continue to hold him in high regard. If he's upset with me, he'll tell me :D
 
It's good to read a post of that nature CC. You acted more rational in that post than 90% of the board as of late ( including myself ). Bravo! And thank you.
 
Well after some flak, some people getting offended and others flat out pissed, I am happy to say after reading some PM's today and yeaterday as well - and seeing the boards - I along with some of others did have some effect.

The transgessors are both making things right and I do believe in both cases dealing with this situation can be and will be chalked up to newbie mistakes.

As I just wrote to one person, most people end up making a mistake when they are a newbie, and it is how they deal with that mistake that marks them. If they handle it well then you can consider it a "right of passage" if you will.

Yes, I was harsh but in the end it made the situation get corrected and hopefully prevented other questionable puts from other newbies that may have considered putting in less than what was deserved (not saying all of them would here, just in case just one other would have) and taught a lesson to the masses as it were.

CP has always been a very friendly site, very welcoming to newbies and had the highest intergity. Though not everyone has been saying so, I know most of us want to keep it that way. Unfortunately that also means at times we (we being those who been around awhile and FOG's) are going to be overprotective, demanding, offensive, etc. to get our points across to try and avoid future cases as what we have seen around here lately.

I can say in my case at least, that it doesn't mean I am not newbie-friendly, or not willing to forgive a newbie mistake or want to be a board :policeman". It does mean though that I want this place to continue to thrive and be a beacon of intergity and fun for both those new to cigars and cigar communties and everyone else too have put in the time and effort when places like this weren't as popular.

Anyway, my respect and thanks to those making it right, to those who accepted my critism and stood behind it and even those who balked at my methods - cause I know you have the same thing in heart as I do - even if we communicate that differently.

And CC - of course I didn't take offense and all is good ;)

Unti later everyone,

Sam
 
I have a thought on all this, I think some people are joing passes and lotteries tring to make a profit, and that not what its about. It's about having fun. You are going to lose in the deal you are going to put more then you take and you are going to lose more the you win(at leaset most of the time) So if you dont like to give away your cigars then you probably should not join passes and lotteries, and stick to trades, but even in trades someone is on the losing end. just my two cents.
 
Ellman said:
I have a thought on all this, I think some people are joing passes and lotteries tring to make a profit, and that not what its about. It's about having fun. You are going to lose in the deal you are going to put more then you take and you are going to lose more the you win(at leaset most of the time) So if you dont like to give away your cigars then you probably should not join passes and lotteries, and stick to trades, but even in trades someone is on the losing end. just my two cents.
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Actually I would say stick around awhile ;)

Call it crazy math but as generous as I try to be on bombings, on passes, etc. I can honestly say I have gained a lot more than I have given. I think most people who have been around awhile will say the same thing. It's an unwritten law I think (I say think because there is nothing like this written in stone and FOG's keep quiet on this subject) that the more generous you are the more you receive.

Does it all happen at once? Of course not, it can be a very slow process. But that's just how things "work". One of the reasons it can be slow is to ensure people aren't putting up a false front in order to gain back that generosity. It's also called "pay it forward".

As far as trading goes, if it isn't a win-win situation for both parties then neither party should be trading ;)

As far as your observation about some people joining in order to make a "profit" you are right on the money with that. No, it is not eveyrone doing that, and not even all that observable - you just have to keep your eyes open and heed some advice that was already given - Cohiba Surfer wrote on this subject as a matter of fact. However, it is such a small fraction that very little risk is really present and with all the chest thumping and such that has been happening is really more to keep honest people honest - the bad apples won't be affected at all and they will be readily apparent ;)

So stick in there, keep Paying it Forward and trust me the Crazy Math will add up, between great returns on passes you start, in unexpected bombs coming to blow your front porch off, to discounted prices on cigars your interested in, to leads you would of never found on your own to other cigars, to some dynamite trades that you would swear was not "win-win" (even if they are), and of course some great friendships and contacts that can help you with more than just cigars if you ever do need that help.

Sam
 
I will be short....
I breezed over this and other subject plus had been doing some reading/PM to boot.
This kind of thing will happen even on the best boards (CP is up there).
You can only hope the people you deal with in trades/passes/puschases are going to be straight up.
Also we all need to be understanding of another certain fact > ignorance (bit strong word) sometimes plays a factor also.
Example = Guss sends me a stick that looks plain Jane but is really a limited production worth super-prem exchange. I return with a mid/prem out of ignorance but with no malice or second agenda in mind. How are we to differenciate?? Food for thought......
You guys I hope will give some quarter and at least discuss my screw up.
I am a newbie here (like the place) and hope things get worked out, which I am pretty sure they will.
Got more to say - but said I would keep it short - over and out for now.
PS: You folks can PM the heck out of me to discuss things, I only typically visit maybe once a day.

BUD
 
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