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Days of Summer Virtual Pass

:eyeshifts:
There was method to my madness. We put Michael Phelps last in our 4x200 meter relay. Same idea.

Before we all scatter to the wind, I'd like to do a bit of debriefing. Also, don't forget someone is winning a five-pack of cigars.

Some general questions:

Is the 'virtual pass' concept as fun as a regular pass? Is there something to getting a big box of cigars and digging through it?

Were the standards for trades overly vague?

What's a good way to encourage discussion on the Puts/Takes? While I have the final say, did it seem like others' input on trades mattered?

It seemed like a lot of ISOMs went untouched. Is this because of less interest, or fewer trade options? What's the right mix in a pass between CCs and NCs?

Where did I put my keys?

Any other criticism or comments?

And would you want to do this again next year?
 
Gavin said:
:eyeshifts:
There was method to my madness. We put Michael Phelps last in our 4x200 meter relay. Same idea.

Before we all scatter to the wind, I'd like to do a bit of debriefing. Also, don't forget someone is winning a five-pack of cigars. (WHAT ! I forgot about that!)

Some general questions:

Is the 'virtual pass' concept as fun as a regular pass? Is there something to getting a big box of cigars and digging through it?

Never been in a 'real' pass but I can tell this one rocked !

Were the standards for trades overly vague?

Once we cleared the 1$ limit I was faily simple I'd say

What's a good way to encourage discussion on the Puts/Takes? While I have the final say, did it seem like others' input on trades mattered?

For me it did, I had the chance to fall unpon a great BOTL that helped me get around and showed me how to come up with better prices comparaison. It's difficult to encourage discussion on this suject for me because of the lack of knowledge I have. BUt be certain it gets better every day!

It seemed like a lot of ISOMs went untouched. Is this because of less interest, or fewer trade options? What's the right mix in a pass between CCs and NCs?

Well I would have liked to catch more but the price differences were hard for me to get around. So I would go for the lack of option on my part :whistling:

Where did I put my keys?

Probably where you did not look... :rolleyes: ...yet

Any other criticism or comments?

Maybe putting up the price references next to each stcik to save some searching but aside from that nothing much.

And would you want to do this again next year?

And this is where I wanna hear a HELL YEAH folks !
Click to expand...


Answers in bold.

Gavin once again thnak you for having me is was a blast to participate and follow the pass during the last few weeks. I hope everyone enjoyed it like I did.
 
Not that I'm trying to win the contest, but it wouldn't hurt, I have many thoughts on this pass.

1. Is the 'virtual pass' concept as fun as a regular pass? Is there something special about getting a big box of cigars and digging through it? Yes! But I believe this to be better, yes it's exciting to get a big tupperware container of cigars in the mail, but the $30 to remail it, the upkeep that comes along with it, unpacking and repackaging, ect. So much less hassle, so much less worry. Peace of mind knowing someone isn't going to run off with a thousand + dollars of someone's cigars. Better to have a small flat rate box of cigars go missing in the mail, than 50-75 cigars, plus swag ect, some of the cigars are irreplaceable and so on. I also enjoy that we could all send you a "little thank you" without everyone knowing our amount of generosity, not that it's a big worry for me, but I feel it's like a bomb, no one should know what has in it, but the sender and receiver.
2. Were the standards for trades overly vague? I didn't mind the rules of the puts and takes, but I wouldn't object to them being a little more extensive, make the researching cigars and prices easier, but overall it wasn't a concern!
3. What's a good way to encourage discussion on the Puts/Takes? While I have the final say, did it seem like others' input on trades mattered? I think we did a fairly decent job at discussing, it was all done tactfully and with respect. No one did it out of malice, anything said was to insure everyone was getting a fair trade. Concerns were raised, discussed, decided upon, and we moved on. But in the end, your opinion is what matters, it's your cigars at the end of the day. You allowed everyone to voice their opinions, so your agreed with, some you disagreed, but the knowledge helped us all out.
4. It seemed like a lot of ISOMs went untouched. Is this because of less interest, or fewer trade options? What's the right mix in a pass between CCs and NCs? I believe there was a large volume of CCs in the starting list, having so many made it harder to trade CC for CC for some of the members with a small CC collection. I know I have many CCs that I only have one of and have never tried or only tried once, and don't necessarily want to trade away for something else I've never tried. On top of that, there is a very limited amount of CCs compared to the amount of NCs on the market today, which also happens to be easier to research. Finding MSRP for CCs is difficult for most, not many have reputable sources to pull information from. I personally would like to see the list 50/50. Those points aside, there were also some nicely aged CCs in the list, which made it much harder to match the rarity and value on top of CC for CC!
5. Where did I put my keys? They are between the couch cushions closer to the back, next to the stale Funyun from 2004 and the wheat penny with the lint stuck to it.
6. Any other criticism or comments? This was a great pass and it SAILED along. Very quick and painless! Great bunch of guys involved this go round!
7. And would you want to do this again next year? Hell yeah, in a heart beat. I'll be the first to sign up and probably the last to go!
 
Gavin said:
:eyeshifts:
There was method to my madness. We put Michael Phelps last in our 4x200 meter relay. Same idea.

Before we all scatter to the wind, I'd like to do a bit of debriefing. Also, don't forget someone is winning a five-pack of cigars.

Some general questions:

Is the 'virtual pass' concept as fun as a regular pass? Is there something to getting a big box of cigars and digging through it?I agree that it is better to get a big box in the mail and see what it has inside. However, this is much safer and moved more smoothly than any pass I have participated in or watched. The fact of shipping smaller packages reduces the opportunity for error.

Were the standards for trades overly vague?I think once we decided on a threshold it was fine. I think it would be good to clarify that in the beginning if this is done again.

What's a good way to encourage discussion on the Puts/Takes? While I have the final say, did it seem like others' input on trades mattered?I felt like the correspondence was excellent by all accounts. The discussion was always civil and very informative. This was a great to see everyones input.

It seemed like a lot of ISOMs went untouched. Is this because of less interest, or fewer trade options? What's the right mix in a pass between CCs and NCs?There were quite a few CC's in the mix when I went first and I just don't have the extensive collection of these that others might have. I did grab a couple though. I think a mix of 25% CC's, 75% NC's would be better.

Where did I put my keys?Did you check your pockets?

Any other criticism or comments?This was a ton of fun except for the time frame that you handed it off to CJ. Then it got ugly for awhile. Just kiddin', this was a blast, thank you for your efforts.

And would you want to do this again next year?Most definitely.
Click to expand...
 
: Some general questions:

Is the 'virtual pass' concept as fun as a regular pass? Is there something to getting a big box of cigars and digging through it? Since I have never done a regular pass I can only say I really like this concept. As others have said it takes a lot of the risk and cost out of the picture.

Were the standards for trades overly vague? Since this was my first pass a bit more clarity to start with would have been helpful.

What's a good way to encourage discussion on the Puts/Takes? While I have the final say, did it seem like others' input on trades mattered? I thought it went very well, I believe I learned the most from the chit chat. A lot of knowledge in this group.

It seemed like a lot of ISOMs went untouched. Is this because of less interest, or fewer trade options? What's the right mix in a pass between CCs and NCs? Since I have maybe 3 CCs and smoked around 3, I was in no position to touch them. Over time I am sure I will acquire more and would be more interested in the CCs than the NCs.

Where did I put my keys? They are in your car.

Any other criticism or comments? Very enjoyable, as I told you earlier. I get it now.

And would you want to do this again next year? Yes.
 
Gavin said:
:eyeshifts:
There was method to my madness. We put Michael Phelps last in our 4x200 meter relay. Same idea.

Before we all scatter to the wind, I'd like to do a bit of debriefing. Also, don't forget someone is winning a five-pack of cigars. My addy is in my profile... :laugh:

Some general questions:

Is the 'virtual pass' concept as fun as a regular pass? Is there something to getting a big box of cigars and digging through it?

Were the standards for trades overly vague?

What's a good way to encourage discussion on the Puts/Takes? While I have the final say, did it seem like others' input on trades mattered?

It seemed like a lot of ISOMs went untouched. Is this because of less interest, or fewer trade options? What's the right mix in a pass between CCs and NCs?

Where did I put my keys?

Any other criticism or comments?

And would you want to do this again next year?
Click to expand...
wkoti said:
Not that I'm trying to win the contest, but it wouldn't hurt, I have many thoughts on this pass.

1. Is the 'virtual pass' concept as fun as a regular pass? Is there something special about getting a big box of cigars and digging through it? Yes! But I believe this to be better, yes it's exciting to get a big tupperware container of cigars in the mail, but the $30 to remail it, the upkeep that comes along with it, unpacking and repackaging, ect. So much less hassle, so much less worry. Peace of mind knowing someone isn't going to run off with a thousand + dollars of someone's cigars. Better to have a small flat rate box of cigars go missing in the mail, than 50-75 cigars, plus swag ect, some of the cigars are irreplaceable and so on. I also enjoy that we could all send you a "little thank you" without everyone knowing our amount of generosity, not that it's a big worry for me, but I feel it's like a bomb, no one should know what has in it, but the sender and receiver.
2. Were the standards for trades overly vague? I didn't mind the rules of the puts and takes, but I wouldn't object to them being a little more extensive, make the researching cigars and prices easier, but overall it wasn't a concern!
3. What's a good way to encourage discussion on the Puts/Takes? While I have the final say, did it seem like others' input on trades mattered? I think we did a fairly decent job at discussing, it was all done tactfully and with respect. No one did it out of malice, anything said was to insure everyone was getting a fair trade. Concerns were raised, discussed, decided upon, and we moved on. But in the end, your opinion is what matters, it's your cigars at the end of the day. You allowed everyone to voice their opinions, so your agreed with, some you disagreed, but the knowledge helped us all out.
4. It seemed like a lot of ISOMs went untouched. Is this because of less interest, or fewer trade options? What's the right mix in a pass between CCs and NCs? I believe there was a large volume of CCs in the starting list, having so many made it harder to trade CC for CC for some of the members with a small CC collection. I know I have many CCs that I only have one of and have never tried or only tried once, and don't necessarily want to trade away for something else I've never tried. On top of that, there is a very limited amount of CCs compared to the amount of NCs on the market today, which also happens to be easier to research. Finding MSRP for CCs is difficult for most, not many have reputable sources to pull information from. I personally would like to see the list 50/50. Those points aside, there were also some nicely aged CCs in the list, which made it much harder to match the rarity and value on top of CC for CC! I have 0 CC's to trade the 10 or so singles I have were all gifts and I will smoke them at some point. So for a pass the more NC the better for me right now but i see that changing really quick... :whistling:
5. Where did I put my keys? They are between the couch cushions closer to the back, next to the stale Funyun from 2004 and the wheat penny with the lint stuck to it.
6. Any other criticism or comments? This was a great pass and it SAILED along. Very quick and painless! Great bunch of guys involved this go round!
7. And would you want to do this again next year? Hell yeah, in a heart beat. I'll be the first to sign up and probably the last to go!
Click to expand...

I agree with CJ to the fullest!

Great pass great host great ideas and great team work!

I added to a couple comments in red!

Hope you all have a good weekend! Its going to be a scorcha here in NH! :thumbs:

TP
 
Is the 'virtual pass' concept as fun as a regular pass? Is there something to getting a big box of cigars and digging through it?
The big box is fun to get but like many have said the cost and danger of it getting lost,stolen or damage realy makes this a better choice. Was also very fast and easy to keep up with. Not long waits where nothing happened.
Were the standards for trades overly vague? Maybe some prices set by each stick for quick reference but I was fine with how it was.

What's a good way to encourage discussion on the Puts/Takes? While I have the final say, did it seem like others' input on trades mattered? Once we had the rules set in stone this went smoother then I have seen and there was no out lash of anger or miss understand. Very friendly pass.

It seemed like a lot of ISOMs went untouched. Is this because of less interest, or fewer trade options? What's the right mix in a pass between CCs and NCs? I have so few CCs no way I could trade for such nice ones.

Where did I put my keys? I have them and will sell to highest bidder.

Any other criticism or comments? Honestly was a joy to be involved.

And would you want to do this again next year? With out a doubt. I still say we do a winter one.

Tuttle
 
Is the 'virtual pass' concept as fun as a regular pass? Is there something to getting a big box of cigars and digging through it?
I actually think I enjoyed it more. Less hassle and worry, especially since we have some really nasty heat to deal with down here.

Were the standards for trades overly vague?
I think they were fine, especially after a price ceiling was established. I still don't quite get the aged\rarity\price ratio but I think that something that comes with time(and is subject to the opinion of the pass leader).

What's a good way to encourage discussion on the Puts/Takes? While I have the final say, did it seem like others' input on trades mattered?
There was a lot of good discussion. For me, I find myself wanting to argue price more, but also don't want to seem like an ass so don't. Which is a personal issue.

It seemed like a lot of ISOMs went untouched. Is this because of less interest, or fewer trade options? What's the right mix in a pass between CCs and NCs?
Definitely not lack of interest. Probably alot fewer trade options. What mostly didn't move much was smaller, lower price vitolas and older cigars that were aged and difficult to value. I think as noobs we just didn't have deep enough humis for those. 50/50 seems like a good mix.
Where did I put my keys?
The wife has them.

Any other criticism or comments?
I enjoyed this very much.

And would you want to do this again next year?
Damn right I would!


Thanks again for hosting Gavin, this was an excellent experience.
If its alright I'll send my cigars out on Monday to avoid them sitting in a warehouse over the weekend.
 
Some interesting data from post-pass analysis:
The sticks turned over 1.67 times on average.
The most times one slot got traded for was 12. Slot 55, which started with an EP Carillo Edicion Inaugural and ended up an EPC Dark Ritual.
The least was 0, for a lot of them.
The only two NC's that weren't traded were the CAO Habano and the Padilla EL.
The most expensive cigar in the pass did not get traded for (Cohiba Siglo VI).
The least expensive cigar in the pass did not get traded for until the second to last passer (Casa Fernandez Arsenio).
 
Is the 'virtual pass' concept as fun as a regular pass? Is there something to getting a big box of cigars and digging through it?
First pass so can't compare but this is definitely a great concept which was both trouble free and fun at the same time.

Were the standards for trades overly vague?
The $1 ceiling was very manageable and hugely noob friendly.

What's a good way to encourage discussion on the Puts/Takes? While I have the final say, did it seem like others' input on trades mattered?
I think your efforts to withhold your comments till others had spoken promoted both discussion and ample time to consider and digest their opinions.

It seemed like a lot of ISOMs went untouched. Is this because of less interest, or fewer trade options? What's the right mix in a pass between CCs and NCs?
Still being a noob, I haven't yet amassed either the CC inventory nor enough knowledge regarding them yet so I wouldn't have minded seeing a few more NC options in there.

Where did I put my keys?
It's already in the keyhole!

Any other criticism or comments?
Thanks for having me and for all your hard work, it really is appreciated!

And would you want to do this again next year?
Absolutely looking forward it!
 
Before I get started I would first and foremost like to thank you for all of the work, planning and logistics that went into this pass! It was not lost on me and I would feel safe saying that it wasn't lost on anyone.


Is the 'virtual pass' concept as fun as a regular pass? Is there something to getting a big box of cigars and digging through it?

This was a GREAT pass and it was tons of fun. Not to seem like I am gushing, but that is thanks to you mostly. I thought it was pretty expertly put together and administered. It is nice to look through the box when it gets to you, but in my limited experience I have seen that most p/t's are completed before you get the box in the interest of keeping the pass moving so this was not a let down in any fashion. I would like to say also it was nice to keep the cost of participation down as there wasn't a $25- $30 charge to ship the box to the next person. I think most would agree that we would like to spend less on shipping and more on awesome cigars!

Were the standards for trades overly vague?

No. I think that there would have been more conflict if there was a problem here.

What's a good way to encourage discussion on the Puts/Takes? While I have the final say, did it seem like others' input on trades mattered?

I commented earlier in the pass that I thought the communication was superior here, and that everyone was cordial in their discussions. I can't speak for anyone else here but there was a fair amount of discussion regarding my takes before you got to put in your 2 cents. This discussion shaped my p/t's greatly and made it more smoot for you... at least it seemed this way to me.

It seemed like a lot of ISOMs went untouched. Is this because of less interest, or fewer trade options? What's the right mix in a pass between CCs and NCs?

I noticed this as well. I don't think that this had anything to do with a lack of interest (especially on my part). I find it harder to do ISOM p/t's becasue there are less options in a given price range than NC's. Another aside is that because of the construction issues associated with ISOM's, I don't like to put my cigars there in case it may be plugged or something of that nature. I don't ever want someone to feel screwed after dealing with me.

Where did I put my keys?

I think you should follow your dog around the yard for the next few days. LOL

Any other criticism or comments?

Great job!

And would you want to do this again next year?

I would be privileged to be a part of this again next year!
 
Guys, i appreciate the comments. If you haven't weghed in, please do! It only helps me if we do this next year.

I'm going to post up the criteria for winning the Fiver tomorrow and resolve it on Monday.
 
Sorry all, I have been out of the loop for a little bit. Off on holiday with the family and limited internet access.

Joe, NICE go on your turn! Awesome T/P's!

Now, on to answer your questions, Gavin:

1. Is the 'virtual pass' concept as fun as a regular pass? Is there something to getting a big box of cigars and digging through it?
Yes and Yes. IMHO, the virtual pass is the perfect solution for the summer season. For a majority of the time the pass is going on the "big box of sticks" remains in a solid/protected environment. To the second part...granted I'm a newbie, but it is pretty cool when the huge box of sticks shows up on your doorstep. That being said, I was just a s stoked when the small box showed up too.

2. Were the standards for trades overly vague?
No, not really. I guess you could have posted the floor/ceiling for under/over-puts in the OP, but that was taken care of right off the bat.

3. What's a good way to encourage discussion on the Puts/Takes? While I have the final say, did it seem like others' input on trades mattered?
Seems to me that commentary/discussion is just part of participating in a pass. Not sure that needed much encouragement. Yes, I think there were several excellent discussions on T/P's from others that prompted people to go back an reevaluate. Everyone was respectful, helpful and friendly about trades.

4. It seemed like a lot of ISOMs went untouched. Is this because of less interest, or fewer trade options? What's the right mix in a pass between CCs and NCs?
To the first part of your question: for me it was because I had fewer trade options. I am just entering that world and have few to choose from to trade but not many. Really enjoying the learning curve, though, and this pass will have allowed me the opportunity to trade a couple that I have tried several times for ones that I have never tried. To the second part: I think you started this with a spot on mixture.

5. Where did I put my keys?
Stuck in between the cushions of your couch.

6. Any other criticism or comments?
No criticisms, but a "well done!" to all who participated. It was a lot of fun and a good learning curve to boot.

7. And would you want to do this again next year?
Yup! In a flash!

Lastly, a big thank you to Gavin for putting this together and keeping things organized. Really great job!
 
Winning the fiver:
I said that all you had to do was participate in the pass, and that's true. Tomorrow, I'm going to use a random number generator to determine a number between 1 and 635 (the number of this post). Here's what will happen depending on whose post it is:
1) If it is one of my posts, I will add a cigar to the winnings and roll again.
2) If it is not my post, the person whose post it is, will choose the winner. It cannot be themselves, and must be a participant in the pass.
Easy as that.
 
Gavin,

Great job with this new concept. I've never seen it done anywhere, which means you've brought a new concept to cigar pass.

I read your rules numerous times, and am unclear on one point... Does the pass participant pay for shipping both ways for puts/takes? For instance, if you're the host and I'm a participant, do I send you my puts along with a pre-paid click-n-ship label (with your address as the return and mine as the TO)? Looks like total shipping cost will be around $13 or so paid for by the participant, which certainly keeps costs manageable.

I think including virtual passes is a great idea. I'm going to PM you...

Good job.
 
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