Kinder, gentler CP?

[CoventryCat86]

lmao... if any of you had of mentioned PDCA too, I would have ended up needing a slap on the back to stop laughing.

WOW, Wurm, ya got me on that one! :laugh: I had to go look it up.

I've also heard of "DIVE" events (Define, Investigate, Verify, duh......... I dunno what the "E" stands for :whistling: "Enhance" but that's just a guess) but I think that's a company unique rather than a widely known catch phrase.

 

[NullSmurf]

Now I know why you've been scarce, Bill. Somebody taught Mrs Crabtree some quality algorythems! You've succumbed to regular service reviews.

 

[ggiese]

Choice A: A FEW of those prospective new members you talk about would take high insult to anyone making a comment about their clothing, and take great pains to tell the person making the comment how pathetic a human being they were - thereby creating a ruckus with everyone else around.

I feel that the "making a comment" part should be constructive and work towards a remedy for the problem. Others feel that almost any comment is okay and it's only about how the prospective member reacts. I guess a happy combination of both keeps new, good people coming in, overall.

Many actually see it as their "job" to be the first, biggest, and most prolific abuser of a newb who makes a mistake.

I don't know that I would call it "many". "Some", or "a few" perhaps - but not "many".

You're analogy of the dress code at the "club" was spot on with the situation of newbs coming to this community. There are a set of mores for the board (for good reason) - and conformity is expected. It doesn't really matter why it is expected, because the community sets the standards. But it truly is in a new member's best interest to accept the fact the community has, and is, successfully existing because there are standards - and those standards need to be followed.

As painful as it is, (and being member moderated), there will be "a few" that will take on the "job" of ensuring new members live within the community standard. But - "member" moderated not only means slapping around the bad newbs from time to time - it also means the scrutiny of the community for those that have accepted the "job" of doing the slapping.

Not everyone likes the police, ya know...

 

[SamClemmons]

Choice A: A FEW of those prospective new members you talk about would take high insult to anyone making a comment about their clothing, and take great pains to tell the person making the comment how pathetic a human being they were - thereby creating a ruckus with everyone else around.

I feel that the "making a comment" part should be constructive and work towards a remedy for the problem. Others feel that almost any comment is okay and it's only about how the prospective member reacts. I guess a happy combination of both keeps new, good people coming in, overall.

Many actually see it as their "job" to be the first, biggest, and most prolific abuser of a newb who makes a mistake.

I don't know that I would call it "many". "Some", or "a few" perhaps - but not "many".

You're analogy of the dress code at the "club" was spot on with the situation of newbs coming to this community. There are a set of mores for the board (for good reason) - and conformity is expected. It doesn't really matter why it is expected, because the community sets the standards. But it truly is in a new member's best interest to accept the fact the community has, and is, successfully existing because there are standards - and those standards need to be followed.

As painful as it is, (and being member moderated), there will be "a few" that will take on the "job" of ensuring new members live within the community standard. But - "member" moderated not only means slapping around the bad newbs from time to time - it also means the scrutiny of the community for those that have accepted the "job" of doing the slapping.

Not everyone likes the police, ya know...

There's no sense arguing this nonsense George. These boys are part of the minority for a reason.

NA

 

[ggiese]

Choice A: A FEW of those prospective new members you talk about would take high insult to anyone making a comment about their clothing, and take great pains to tell the person making the comment how pathetic a human being they were - thereby creating a ruckus with everyone else around.

I feel that the "making a comment" part should be constructive and work towards a remedy for the problem. Others feel that almost any comment is okay and it's only about how the prospective member reacts. I guess a happy combination of both keeps new, good people coming in, overall.

Many actually see it as their "job" to be the first, biggest, and most prolific abuser of a newb who makes a mistake.

I don't know that I would call it "many". "Some", or "a few" perhaps - but not "many".

You're analogy of the dress code at the "club" was spot on with the situation of newbs coming to this community. There are a set of mores for the board (for good reason) - and conformity is expected. It doesn't really matter why it is expected, because the community sets the standards. But it truly is in a new member's best interest to accept the fact the community has, and is, successfully existing because there are standards - and those standards need to be followed.

As painful as it is, (and being member moderated), there will be "a few" that will take on the "job" of ensuring new members live within the community standard. But - "member" moderated not only means slapping around the bad newbs from time to time - it also means the scrutiny of the community for those that have accepted the "job" of doing the slapping.

Not everyone likes the police, ya know...

There's no sense arguing this nonsense George. These boys are part of the minority for a reason.

NA

I should know better - you are absolutely correct. You surely shouldn't have to argue something completely logical.

My apologies for adding to the nonsense.

 

[JHolmes763]

There's no sense arguing this nonsense George. These boys are part of the minority for a reason.

What minority? If you read through this thread, most people, advocate helping people out in a civilized way. You and a few others advocate the "kick 'em in the nuts and see how he reacts" method. It's too bad you can't realize that there multiple ways to handle the situation, old man.

 

[CigarStone]

Choice A: A FEW of those prospective new members you talk about would take high insult to anyone making a comment about their clothing, and take great pains to tell the person making the comment how pathetic a human being they were - thereby creating a ruckus with everyone else around.

I feel that the "making a comment" part should be constructive and work towards a remedy for the problem. Others feel that almost any comment is okay and it's only about how the prospective member reacts. I guess a happy combination of both keeps new, good people coming in, overall.

Many actually see it as their "job" to be the first, biggest, and most prolific abuser of a newb who makes a mistake.

I don't know that I would call it "many". "Some", or "a few" perhaps - but not "many".

You're analogy of the dress code at the "club" was spot on with the situation of newbs coming to this community. There are a set of mores for the board (for good reason) - and conformity is expected. It doesn't really matter why it is expected, because the community sets the standards. But it truly is in a new member's best interest to accept the fact the community has, and is, successfully existing because there are standards - and those standards need to be followed.

As painful as it is, (and being member moderated), there will be "a few" that will take on the "job" of ensuring new members live within the community standard. But - "member" moderated not only means slapping around the bad newbs from time to time - it also means the scrutiny of the community for those that have accepted the "job" of doing the slapping.

Not everyone likes the police, ya know...

There's no sense arguing this nonsense George. These boys are part of the minority for a reason.

NA

I am all for the slapping around of bad newbs, I got what I deserved when I first joined and it made me back up and look at where I was and what I was doing. I think it's pretty unanimous though that there are a few (and you're right, it's few rather than many) who think it's cute to slap all newbs around just to get their own few seconds of fame. Their logic is that the good ones will learn and the bad ones will go away. Ignorance is bliss.

Just follow the posts in this thread and you can see what I mean. Next will come the name calling and prodding by those "special few"

 

[Infinity]

There's no sense arguing this nonsense George. These boys are part of the minority for a reason.

What minority? If you read through this thread, most people, advocate helping people out in a civilized way. You and a few others advocate the "kick 'em in the nuts and see how he reacts" method. It's too bad you can't realize that there multiple ways to handle the situation, oldman.

You are correct, there are multiple ways to handle a situation but your last comment is not one of them, that's called baiting.

Brian

 

[ironpeddler]

I had a mentor early on in my life who we affectionately called "Uncle Marty"....he had a very simplistic approach to life that I practice to this very day.

Uncle Marty equated all things in life to the way you raised a dog.

If your dog ate the garbage or chewed up a shoe or ran away from home...you stop them from what they are doing, get their attention, and patiently teach them the correct way...over...and over...and over, until they finally get it right. The results are very rewarding for both of you with the results being that you have a great pet.

If one of your kids did something impulsively without thinking first, you stop them from what they are doing, get their attention, and patiently teach them the correct way...over...and over...and over, until they finally get it right.The results are very rewarding, because you love them so much, while helping to smooth out the bumps of life.

If I had an employee that made a mistake at work, no matter what the consequences were....you stop them from what they are doing, get their attention, and patiently teach them the correct way...over...and over...and over, until they finally get it right. The results are very rewarding when you see them grow into a better person.

Uncle Marty's point being, yelling and screaming and slapping a dog around gets you nowhere and teaches them nothing.

It's all about patience.

You reap what you sow.

 

[JHolmes763]

There's no sense arguing this nonsense George. These boys are part of the minority for a reason.

What minority? If you read through this thread, most people, advocate helping people out in a civilized way. You and a few others advocate the "kick 'em in the nuts and see how he reacts" method. It's too bad you can't realize that there multiple ways to handle the situation, oldman.

You are correct, there are multiple ways to handle a situation but your last comment is not one of them, that's called baiting.

Brian

If we're "boys" then he's an "oldman". I guess I took the bait first...

 

[SamClemmons]

I am all for the slapping around of bad newbs, I got what I deserved when I first joined and it made me back up and look at where I was and what I was doing. I think it's pretty unanimous though that there are a few (and you're right, it's few rather than many) who think it's cute to slap all newbs around just to get their own few seconds of fame. Their logic is that the good ones will learn and the bad ones will go away. Ignorance is bliss.

Just follow the posts in this thread and you can see what I mean. Next will come the name calling and prodding by those "special few"

Are you saying that George or I "slap all newbs around"? Really? Would you care to show me where exactly you discovered this pattern of abuse? I can only think of a single instance where I busted on someone who didn't deserve it... and I apologized when I realized it.

NA

 

[MadMonk]

I had a mentor early on in my life who we affectionately called "Uncle Marty"....he had a very simplistic approach to life that I practice to this very day.

Uncle Marty equated all things in life to the way you raised a dog.

If your dog ate the garbage or chewed up a shoe or ran away from home...you stop them from what they are doing, get their attention, and patiently teach them the correct way...over...and over...and over, until they finally get it right. The results are very rewarding for both of you with the results being that you have a great pet.

If one of your kids did something impulsively without thinking first, you stop them from what they are doing, get their attention, and patiently teach them the correct way...over...and over...and over, until they finally get it right.The results are very rewarding, because you love them so much, while helping to smooth out the bumps of life.

If I had an employee that made a mistake at work, no matter what the consequences were....you stop them from what they are doing, get their attention, and patiently teach them the correct way...over...and over...and over, until they finally get it right. The results are very rewarding when you see them grow into a better person.

Uncle Marty's point being, yelling and screaming and slapping a dog around gets you nowhere and teaches them nothing.

It's all about patience.

You reap what you sow.

Yep. As the old saying goes, "patience is a virtue". But in my 50 years, I've learned that I benefit just as much, if not more, than the recipient.

 

[grateful1]

"If you don't like it here, why don't you move to another country ..."

"Change the channel if you don't like my F-words."

"If you don't like it, leave."

"If You Don't Like the News...Go Out and Make Some of Your Own."

"'If you don't like it then don't watch it"

"If you don't like it, don't do it."

"If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change your attitude. Don't complain. "

5r' of dog rockets if you can tell us who is beiong quoted(hint - they are quotes by different people).

Oh yea. LINKY

<edit - this will end 6/25/08 at 11:59 am EST.>

 

[Bsneed51]

"If you don't like it here, why don't you move to another country ..." John Silveria

"Change the channel if you don't like my F-words." Gordon Ramsey

"If you don't like it, leave." Merle Haggard

"If You Don't Like the News...Go Out and Make Some of Your Own." Scoop Nisker

"'If you don't like it then don't watch it" George Carlin

"If you don't like it, don't do it." my grandmother

"If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change your attitude. Don't complain. " Maya Angelou

5r' of dog rockets if you can tell us who is beiong quoted(hint - they are quotes by different people).

Here is my attempt at answering this.

I have nothing else to add to this thread, but it is an interesting topic and an enjoyable read.

 

[mrjinglesusa]

I agree with Bill and Neal.

CP has existed for over 7 years and will continue to exist because the system WORKS. Nothing needs to change. I see no reason why the community should bend over backwards to accomodate the fragile egos of a few people, especially when 50% of new members post a question (or simply join) and are never heard from again.


BTW, out of our 6,720 registered members:

3,680 (55%) have 0 or 1 post;

4,500 (67%) have 5 or fewer posts;

4,908 (73%) have 10 or fewer posts;

5,672 (84%) have 50 or fewer posts;

2,019 (30%) haven't posted in over a year;

3,757 (56%) haven't been on the board in over a year (NOTE: This probably includes people who set their last active status to "Private"); and

Of the 1,097 members that have joined thus far this year, 704 (64%) have posted ONCE or NOT AT ALL


There are 3,960 members (59%) who have been members for a year or more and have less than 100 posts (which I would classify as being inactive).


My point is two-fold:

1) Just because someone joins and posts an introduction, doesn't mean that they have any intention of becoming a contributing member of this community, and


2) Total member count doesn't mean jack. Even though total membership appears to be increasing, the number of ACTIVE members hasn't changed a whole lot in the past 2-3 years. In other words, we still only have about 2,000 or so "active" members.

 

[ggiese]

<snip>
2) Total member count doesn't mean jack. Even though total membership appears to be increasing, the number of ACTIVE members hasn't changed a whole lot in the past 2-3 years. In other words, we still only have about 2,000 or so "active" members.

Hmmmm.... 2,000 or so "active" members

There's no sense arguing this nonsense George. These boys are part of the minority for a reason.

What minority? If you read through this thread, most people, advocate helping people out in a civilized way. You and a few others advocate the "kick 'em in the nuts and see how he reacts" method. It's too bad you can't realize that there multiple ways to handle the situation, old man.

"most people" would suggest well over 1,000...


Hmmm... The math is not adding up, for some strange reason... :whistling:

 

[SamClemmons]

All right let's slow down a second. It has been asserted by the malcontents that there are those of us who prey on newblers. I deny this assertion emphatically. Where is this abuse taking place? Which newblers have been "kicked in the nuts" without cause? Where is the documentation of this abuse? If you boys don't respond with your evidence then we can assume that you are lying dogs. Yes?

NA

 

[Rebel Herfer]

All right let's slow down a second. It has been asserted by the malcontents that there are those of us who prey on newblers. I deny this assertion emphatically. Where is this abuse taking place? Which newblers have been "kicked in the nuts" without cause? Where is the documentation of this abuse? If you boys don't respond with your evidence then we can assume that you are lying dogs. Yes?

NA

Neal - I'm all for kicking those that deserve it in the nuts. Maybe your definition of "deserve" is different than someone elses. And YES we have had your question of evidence and I believe it was answered in the affirmative; it really is a moot point to argue it.
To everyone:
Let's set aside our personal grievances and stay on point. Afterall we are asking Noobs to behave like adults so it does us no good to decend into personal attacks and name calling.
CP has evolved, whether you or anybody likes it, or believes otherwise. Where we are now is "Do we choose to stand, cement footed to the caveman mentality?" or "Do we choose to try something new and see if it works?"
I want to clify an earlier comment of mine: I do NOT advocate letting unregistered users being able to post in all areas of CP, only in a General Questions area. Just an idea, nobody is forcing it on you, just suggesting it.
Ggiese makes a valid observation - we are not increasing contributing members at the same rate we are increasing registered users. Not sure that was the point he was trying to make but poignant nonetheless. We can continue to get the same results doing the same thing, or try to become stronger by trying something new and increasing the contributing membership.
Cigar reviews are posted so that someone else might find it appealing and try that cigar, it's about exploring the possibilities. We can have a civil discussion and find something to try.

 

[BkCloud114]

I'm just here for grateful1's links.... keep them coming

 

[SamClemmons]

All right let's slow down a second. It has been asserted by the malcontents that there are those of us who prey on newblers. I deny this assertion emphatically. Where is this abuse taking place? Which newblers have been "kicked in the nuts" without cause? Where is the documentation of this abuse? If you boys don't respond with your evidence then we can assume that you are lying dogs. Yes?

NA

Neal - I'm all for kicking those that deserve it in the nuts. Maybe your definition of "deserve" is different than someone elses. And YES we have had your question of evidence and I believe it was answered in the affirmative; it really is a moot point to argue it.

I'll buy that. Where was it answered? It's not a moot point, it's a fuggin' lie. I don't do it, I didn't do it and anyone says I did is a lying dog. Mmmmkay?

NA