Newbie Training Cigar Pass-- For February 07-

[wanlail]

I had a tat lancero today and almost litup the RC, but decided an hour wasn't enough time to enjoy it since i had work. Maybe i'll do it sometime this month..... or wait until my birthday.

 

[tomthirtysix]

SJM goes away, and everyone gets quiet. Come on... there's got to be some people in the pass we haven't heard anything from.

And by the looks of the list, this thing is getting close. Can't wait!

 

[wanlail]

yea TTS, you're gonna get all the crappy cigars on your end.

 

[mdutch]

IT'S HERE! IT'S HERE!

Ooooohhhh yeah. USPS dropped it by last night. :thumbs:
I'll do a re-pack as the box is a little careworn and soft. :0

And, it arrived just in time, since tonight (27th) is our end-of-the-month herf for the DFW Cigar Society. And we've got a special guest attending... (See below, I'm a big fan of the La Aurora product line) So I thought I'd bring the list along to introduce more of our club to the "pass" concept, and get their .02 on puts and takes. I'll post my suggestions by Thursday and try to get 'em back on the road this weekend.

Post by Mowee at Cigarutopia.com
We are back up at Stafford & Jones in Richardson (corner of Plano and Campbell Roads) for our usual end of month herf on Tuesday the 27th. But this time we have another guest....Jose Blanco from La Aurora. Jose is very knowledgable and willing to share what he knows. There will also be a La Aurora event at the store. We'll start around 5pm. Everyone is welcome... See yall there.

 

[tomthirtysix]

Wow... sounds like a great time. Enjoy!!

 

[wanlail]

Have a great time at the herf MD, maybe one of these days when i'm in your neck of the woods i'll get to enjoy a cool event like that. Maybe i should have left that preferido for you

 

[defetis]

Things are really slow in here, we need somemore contests.... maybe ill think of one

 

[wanlail]

Things are slow because SJM isn't here to make fun of

 

[mdutch]

Things are slow because SJM isn't here to make fun of

Yeah, right. Are we smokers, or ARE WE SMOKERS! Let the man have some fun! Geezie Chreezie!

Okay, I'm about 12 scotches to the wind, and I've gotta tell ya, Jose Blanco is the coolest wholesale rep I've met. Sincerity is a "given" as you've gotta be able to fake that, or the rest doesn't fall into place. But as VP at La Aurora, this guy knows his stuff. He's hosted a recent "visit" by a half-dozen DFWCS members to the DR, and has been very open and receptive to our opinions and critiques. The latter being few and far between, as their construction and CONSISTENCY makes their entire line a great go-to. (And, no, I'm not getting paid for any of this, I'm just tired of laying out bucks for big "recommendations" and finding serious variation between one box and another over the years.) I'll put my big fat toady opinion on the line here, but for my money, the La Aurora is the BEST line of consistently superb smokes I've ever ventured into, past the ISOM.

And so, I'm gonna give up an entirely La Aurora line of smokes for my puts in this pass, and hope the end-recipient really enjoys one or two of them. Enough rhapsodic drivel. Let's cut to the chase.

Takes:
40. Placensia Reserve Organica, Toro (P:Saxjazzman, T:Mdutch)
69. Padron 1926 (Pefetis, T:Mdutch)
79. Tatuaje Hermoso (P:Wanlail, T:Mdutch)

Puts: (in no particular order)
80. La Aurora Leon Jimenes Camaroon 2001
81. La Aurora Leon Jimenez SUMO
82. La Aurora Preferido
83. La Aurora Preferido 1903 Series Ruby Tubo
84. La Aurora Leon Jimenes #4 "Don Fernando"

Tell me what ya think.

 

[wanlail]

Looks good to me. One recomendation on the Tatuaje since it came from me. The box is from this year, so it hasn't had much time to sit. I think I got them two weeks ago? Its smoking well, but is still giving off some of the young taste, so if you can bear to let it sit, it'll be delicious.

 

[mdutch]

Looks good to me. One recomendation on the Tatuaje since it came from me. The box is from this year, so it hasn't had much time to sit. I think I got them two weeks ago? Its smoking well, but is still giving off some of the young taste, so if you can bear to let it sit, it'll be delicious.

NP, and thanks for the heads-up. Two of my favorite obiwans at tonight's herf suggested that I pick it as an out-of-the-ordinary stick, so I'll let it sleep till at least Xmas 2008 for a rest and then light it up.

 

[tomthirtysix]

And so, I'm gonna give up an entirely La Aurora line of smokes for my puts in this pass, and hope the end-recipient really enjoys one or two of them. Enough rhapsodic drivel. Let's cut to the chase.

Takes:
40. Placensia Reserve Organica, Toro (P:Saxjazzman, T:Mdutch)
69. Padron 1926 (Pefetis, T:Mdutch)
79. Tatuaje Hermoso (P:Wanlail, T:Mdutch)

Puts: (in no particular order)
80. La Aurora Leon Jimenes Camaroon 2001
81. La Aurora Leon Jimenez SUMO
82. La Aurora Preferido
83. La Aurora Preferido 1903 Series Ruby Tubo
84. La Aurora Leon Jimenes #4 "Don Fernando"

Tell me what ya think.

Which Preferido is #82? Because something here doesn't look right. The Padron (#69) has an MSRP of $20, and I found prices on all your Puts except for #82 because I don't know which one it is. This was why SJM wanted ups to list MSRP. Depending on what #82 is, I only really see one possible match. #79 at $6.75 with either #80 or #84.

 

[Satchmo]

Things are slow because SJM isn't here to make fun of

Yeah, right. Are we smokers, or ARE WE SMOKERS! Let the man have some fun! Geezie Chreezie!

Okay, I'm about 12 scotches to the wind, and I've gotta tell ya, Jose Blanco is the coolest wholesale rep I've met. Sincerity is a "given" as you've gotta be able to fake that, or the rest doesn't fall into place. But as VP at La Aurora, this guy knows his stuff. He's hosted a recent "visit" by a half-dozen DFWCS members to the DR, and has been very open and receptive to our opinions and critiques. The latter being few and far between, as their construction and CONSISTENCY makes their entire line a great go-to. (And, no, I'm not getting paid for any of this, I'm just tired of laying out bucks for big "recommendations" and finding serious variation between one box and another over the years.) I'll put my big fat toady opinion on the line here, but for my money, the La Aurora is the BEST line of consistently superb smokes I've ever ventured into, past the ISOM.

And so, I'm gonna give up an entirely La Aurora line of smokes for my puts in this pass, and hope the end-recipient really enjoys one or two of them. Enough rhapsodic drivel. Let's cut to the chase.

Takes:
40. Placensia Reserve Organica, Toro (P:Saxjazzman, T:Mdutch)
69. Padron 1926 (Pefetis, T:Mdutch)
79. Tatuaje Hermoso (P:Wanlail, T:Mdutch)

Puts: (in no particular order)
80. La Aurora Leon Jimenes Camaroon 2001
81. La Aurora Leon Jimenez SUMO
82. La Aurora Preferido
83. La Aurora Preferido 1903 Series Ruby Tubo
84. La Aurora Leon Jimenes #4 "Don Fernando"

Tell me what ya think.

What do you think of the Emerald? They sound awesome!!

Quade

 

[beaucredo]

The Emerald is fantastic, but that is the only one i had. The emerald I like better than the VSGs

 

[mdutch]

Which Preferido is #82? Because something here doesn't look right. The Padron (#69) has an MSRP of $20, and I found prices on all your Puts except for #82 because I don't know which one it is. This was why SJM wanted ups to list MSRP. Depending on what #82 is, I only really see one possible match. #79 at $6.75 with either #80 or #84.

First off, I prefaced my msg by saying I was about 12 scotches to the wind, so my bad in posting without prices and thinking it through more. Yes, the Padron is pricey, and I realize I'm not hitting that dollar-dollar match. Since you raised an objection, I'll take another look. Would you please post the prices you have to save me some time? (I really don't track prices of expensive domestics, as once things get past $10 a stick, I'm into ISOM territory!)

Here's a more detailed list of my proposed puts. I'm adding two more Leon Jimenes since they're very hard to find. If you still object, post your prices on my takes, and I will either find another stick to match the Padron or leave #69 in favor of another take. And one last clarification. Are we basing this on average market from cigarencyclopedia, or MSRP? Because I can't find all these either way.

80. La Aurora Leon Jimenes Camaroon 2001 $8.50
81. La Aurora Leon Jimenes SUMO Toro Maduro $6.50
82. La Aurora Preferido #2 Corojo $12.00
83. La Aurora Preferido 1903 Series Ruby Tubo $17.00
84. La Aurora Leon Jimenes #4 "Don Fernando" $10.00
85. La Aurora Leon Jimenes #4 "Don Fernando" $10.00
86. La Aurora Leon Jimenes #4 "Don Fernando" $10.00
(Note: The Don Fernando is one of the rarest domestic cigars available, as it is made for the owner in one corona size. Each cigar is draw-tested and the construction and taste are impeccable. If you can get them! Keep your eyes out for this one, and try it if you have the opportunity.)

 

[tomthirtysix]

I was under the impression it was MSRP, and if we couldn't find MSRP, avg market price would work. The Ruby Tubo and the Sumo Toro I got the same price. As far as the Don Fernando goes, when figuring out MSRP, it's box price / box quantity, not the price you would pay for a single. And the $187.50 box price is MSRP because Corona lists the same price as the retail. That would make the MSRP 7.50.

But, beyond that, the P/T were supposed to be value for value:

You can take up to three cigars and replace with equal value but no more than one from any bag.

Some passes, like the Viejo Pass going on now (I think), allow for total value trades. But as far as I can see here, it's been value for value. Now, with the Don Fernando being so rare, that should be taken into consideration, but anything that you put in above and beyond the trades is completely up to you, out of your own generosity, and not supposed to be to make up value because you were short on a trade.

 

[mdutch]

Now, with the Don Fernando being so rare, that should be taken into consideration, but anything that you put in above and beyond the trades is completely up to you, out of your own generosity, and not supposed to be to make up value because you were short on a trade.

Woah there Tom. Check those guns at the door. Before you start inferring I was trying to short a trade, I'd point out that you did not answer my request to post the value of my suggested takes. I want you to know I'm doing my best to be accurate here and certainly don't want to offend anyone . . . which is why I'm in the n00b box pass I guess!

But I DO need some clarification from you. What do you mean by what you said above? ". . . Don Fernando being so rare, that should be taken into consideration..." Sort of clouds the issue and makes it sound like your calculated $7.50 per stick price does not fairly represent the stick's value. That being said however, since the other two Dons are for pure enjoyment, I'll happily concede the $7.50 as the value of that stick. I'm also curious -- have you smoked them before?

Please understand me here. I did NOT intend to make up any "value" by adding more Don Fernandos. I'm including three of them for one reason -- to spread the joy -- nothing else. They're just about my favorite non-ISOM stick and being hard to get, I thought it would be fun to send some along in the box.

Which brings me to the last questions -- I'm also kind of confused by whether or not you're generally satisfied except for the Padron 1926 issue. Do you mean to say the rest of my proposal is value-matched to your satisfaction and it's only the Padron you have a problem with? If so, this is easily fixed. I'll either grab something comparable on the way home or substitute another take for the Padron. And while we're on the subject, I've gotta ask how you "knew" what size Padron 1926 means in order to price it? :whistling: ('specially since you asked for clarification on the prefidio.

A couple more things. I'd like to add that I was confused by all the recent posts talking about using cigarencyclopedia.com as a source. There's 25 pages of msgs here, half of which I haven't read, plus a lot of FAQ to go over, and it wasn't clear to me how we were sourcing the MSRP. Does everyone else agree with T36 on this? And is the MSRP/SRV data sourced from cigar.com or corona?

Tom, PLEASE let me know asap if you have any other objections than the Padron, and be kind enough to tell me what you think the sticks in my "takes" list are worth.

Anyone else care to comment?

 

[wanlail]

On the Padron '26, i'm assuming its the same as the one I dropped into the pass. As far as pricing goes, I used the average values based off of cigarencyclopedia. Most of the values were close to MSRP anyways, the other concensus I took into account was top25 in which I looked at the MSRP v. average paid since some cigars you can't really find the MSRP so well... but since ISOM are out of the Q for now, it wasn't as beneficial.

Whenever I considered the values of your P/Ts, I assumed the ruby tubo was in trade for the '26 and the difference between 17 and 20 were not substantial imo. As far as the Tat I put in, i believe the MSRP was at 6? The only MSRP I don't really know so well is the Placencia. However, this is all my two cents.

 

[tomthirtysix]

Now, with the Don Fernando being so rare, that should be taken into consideration, but anything that you put in above and beyond the trades is completely up to you, out of your own generosity, and not supposed to be to make up value because you were short on a trade.

Woah there Tom. Check those guns at the door. Before you start inferring I was trying to short a trade, I'd point out that you did not answer my request to post the value of my suggested takes. I want you to know I'm doing my best to be accurate here and certainly don't want to offend anyone . . . which is why I'm in the n00b box pass I guess!

But I DO need some clarification from you. What do you mean by what you said above? ". . . Don Fernando being so rare, that should be taken into consideration..." Sort of clouds the issue and makes it sound like your calculated $7.50 per stick price does not fairly represent the stick's value. That being said however, since the other two Dons are for pure enjoyment, I'll happily concede the $7.50 as the value of that stick. I'm also curious -- have you smoked them before?

Please understand me here. I did NOT intend to make up any "value" by adding more Don Fernandos. I'm including three of them for one reason -- to spread the joy -- nothing else. They're just about my favorite non-ISOM stick and being hard to get, I thought it would be fun to send some along in the box.

Which brings me to the last questions -- I'm also kind of confused by whether or not you're generally satisfied except for the Padron 1926 issue. Do you mean to say the rest of my proposal is value-matched to your satisfaction and it's only the Padron you have a problem with? If so, this is easily fixed. I'll either grab something comparable on the way home or substitute another take for the Padron. And while we're on the subject, I've gotta ask how you "knew" what size Padron 1926 means in order to price it? :whistling: ('specially since you asked for clarification on the prefidio.

A couple more things. I'd like to add that I was confused by all the recent posts talking about using cigarencyclopedia.com as a source. There's 25 pages of msgs here, half of which I haven't read, plus a lot of FAQ to go over, and it wasn't clear to me how we were sourcing the MSRP. Does everyone else agree with T36 on this? And is the MSRP/SRV data sourced from cigar.com or corona?

Tom, PLEASE let me know asap if you have any other objections than the Padron, and be kind enough to tell me what you think the sticks in my "takes" list are worth.

Anyone else care to comment?

I wasn't trying to infer that you were shorting a trade. And I have no guns with me. Re-reading it, I can see how it would be taken like that, and for that I apologize. Didn't mean to offend with that.

As far as what size it was, I went back to the post where that Padron was put, and it said it was a #1. So, that's what I'm guessing it is.

As far as where we are getting MSRP from, since it's from the manufacturer, it should be the same everywhere it is listed. I chose Corona for that particular cigar because that was the only other retailer I saw listed that had that particular cigar. And the retail box price for the Don Fernando at Corona matched the box price at the site you listed.

I also assumed the Ruby was the trade for Padron, but according to some of the earlier stuff posted in the pass (first couple pages, I believe... I'll look after I post this) a $3 difference here was viewed as "substantial," as wanlail said.

But, since it's already Wednesday night, and SJM said he was going to be back on Thursday, we can always wait until he returns and get his opinion.

Again, if it seemed that I came out guns blazing, I apologize. That was by no means the intent. Since this is the first pass for just about all of us, I just want to make sure we are all on the same page.

 

[tomthirtysix]

Post #38

I' like to get in, if possible. And I'm also in favor of raising the limit a little. I don't really know if I have much for $3 and under, let alone enough to to a couple P/Ts. $3-8 seems to be the standard for 'regular' sticks from what I've read around the board.

Gentlemen,

The consensus seems to raise the price of the sticks to anything $10 or less. LET'S GO FOR IT!! Protocol on cigar passes seems to be that you replace with an approximately equal value. I don't want this to be a restrictive protocol for this pass since we are not taking about expensive sticks here. If you see something you want to try, go for it and replace it with what you like to smoke. The primary purpose here is for us newbies to get a cigar pass under our belt and learn what the kinks are, and perhaps getting some smokes we haven't tried.

Tomthirtysix, you are in.

I hope we get a couple of old timers to join to guide and help us out.

"Protocol" in a pass is that you replace the stick you've taken with equal or better value. It's not supposed to be a "close enough" kind of thing. When in doubt it is always the norm that you leave it better than you got it. And if this is going to be a pass for newbies to learn how to do things right, then puts and takes need to be monitered so that no one slacks in their puts, then carries that aquired habit over to another pass, hence giving other pass hosts the headache of having to say No.


I thought about this some more, and I'm going to bow out of this. I'm already in several passes right now, two here and another elsewhere, plus I've been thinking about starting another one later this spring. I'm concerned about having too much on my plate and I hate to do anything half-assed, which would be what could happen when I don't have the time or patience left to deal with this. Good luck, and I still strongly suggest you consider finding someone to co-host right from the beginning that's been in a few passes and knows the drill.

Post #96

Thanks for getting it out... happy to be involved. Just thought with it on its way, should just remind everyone of this little bit you posted from the front page:

You can take up to three cigars and replace with equal value but no more than one from any bag.

Are we having puts/takes posted up here for you to OK, SJM?

Since this is a training cigar pass I think that we should play this one by the book so we all get the system down. That means the following:

1) Post when you receive the pass
2) Post puts and takes and wait for confirmation of approval. If no confirmation in 36 hours after posting puts and takes then assume that it is ok and get the box moving to the next location. NOTE: For puts and takes, and again because this is a practice run when you post your puts, put the MSRP on your cigars. This will be good practice in how to look them up.
3) Email next recipient to confirm mailing address and that he or she will be available to receive the box. Life happens and we just want to make sure the pass box is not sitting in the rain or snow on someone's stoop who has had an emergency. This is just an extra safety measure.
4) Once the box has been sent priority, post the DC (Delivery Confirmation) number on CP.
5) Follow the Pass and watch the fun continue!!!!!

Please keep posted to this site as things may change. NorCalCigarLover is our experienced member who is helping us out on this pass. He may post suggestions and recommendations and we may implement them to improve the pass.


Enjoy the weekend and the GAME!!!!

This sounds good SJM, I do like the idea of having the newbies stick to the book, and then some, on their first go around. Discussing P&T's can be a touchy subject with some members, some guys seem to get pushed out of shape when they're P&T's are questioned. Remember, it's happened to all of us and sometimes we just mess up or overlook something. If your going to question somebody's P&T's please do it in a constructive manner and don't accuse them of trying to take advantage from the get go. Likewise, if your P&T's are questioned please listen and make any necessary corrections without getting all butt heart, if a few participants are questioning your P&T's then there probably is a reason.

Here is the rule we are using in the iPass Jazz Pass concerning P&T's,

5. Put & Takes (P/T's) should be: a) value for value, b) rarity for rarity, c) NC for NC, d) Premium for Premium and e) ISOM for ISOM.

For each P/T combination an acceptable exchange value difference of $0.25 will be allowed only if the overall net P/T value exchange is zero.

To calculate the exchange value of a cigar please use the following vendors in the order given: International Cigars, Famous Smoke Shop, Holt's Cigar Company and JR Cigars. Use of the Cigar Pass reference charts is also acceptable in calculating the exchange value for some of the rarer premium cigars.

Hey SJM, did you add those rules to the first post in this pass?