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Please Remember Them

PuroBrat

I am not here :^)
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United States v. Reid -- Final Statements by Judge Young

Mr. Richard C. Reid, hearken now to the sentence the Court imposes upon you.

On counts 1, 5 and 6 the Court sentences you to life in prison in the custody of the United States Attorney General. On counts 2, 3, 4 and 7, the Court sentences you to 20 years in prison on each count, the sentence on each count to run consecutive one with the other. That's 80 years.

On Count 8 the Court sentences you to the mandatory 30 years consecutive to the 80 years just imposed. The Court imposes upon you on each of the eight counts a fine of $250,000 for the aggregate fine of $2 million.

The Court accepts the government's recommendation with respect to restitution and orders restitution in the amount of $298.17 to Andre Bousquet and $5,784 to American Airlines.

The Court imposes upon you the $800 special assessment.

The Court imposes upon you five years supervised release simply because the law requires it. But the life sentences are real life sentences so I need not go any further.

This is the sentence that is provided for by our statutes. It is a fair and a just sentence. It is a righteous sentence. Let me explain this to you.

We are not afraid of any of your terrorist co-conspirators, Mr. Reid. We are Americans. We have been through the fire before. There is all too much war talk here. And I say that to everyone with the utmost respect.

Here in this court where we deal with individuals as individuals, and care for individuals as individuals, as human beings we reach out for justice.

You are not an enemy combatant. You are a terrorist. You are not a soldier in any war. You are a terrorist. To give you that reference, to call you a soldier gives you far too much stature. Whether it is the officers of government who do it or your attorney who does it, or that happens to be your view, you are a terrorist.

And we do not negotiate with terrorists. We do not pass treaties with terrorists. We do not sign documents with terrorists.

We hunt them down one by one and bring them to justice.

So war talk is way out of line in this court. You're a big fellow. But you're not that big. You're no warrior. I know warriors. You are a terrorist. A species of criminal guilty of multiple attempted murders.

In a very real sense Trooper Santiago had it right when first you were taken off that plane and into custody and you wondered where the press and where the TV crews were and he said "you're no big deal". You're no big deal.

What your counsel, what your able counsel and what the equally able United States attorneys have grappled with and what I have as honestly as I know how tried to grapple with, is why you did something so horrific. What was it that led you here to this courtroom today? I have listened respectfully to what you have to say. And I ask you to search your heart and ask yourself what sort of unfathomable hate led you to do what you are guilty and admit you are guilty of doing.

And I have an answer for you. It may not satisfy you. But as I search this entire record it comes as close to understanding as I know.

It seems to me you hate the one thing that to us is most precious. You hate our freedom. Our individual freedom. Our individual freedom to live as we choose, to come and go as we choose, to believe or not believe as we individually choose.

Here, in this society, the very winds carry freedom. They carry it everywhere from sea to shining sea. It is because we prize individual freedom so much that you are here in this beautiful courtroom. So that everyone can see, truly see that justice is administered fairly, individually, and discretely.

It is for freedom's seek that your lawyers are striving so vigorously on your behalf and have filed appeals, will go on in their representation of you before other judges. We care about it. Because we all know that the way we treat you, Mr. Reid, is the measure of our own liberties.

Make no mistake though. It is yet true that we will bear any burden; pay any price, to preserve our freedoms.

Look around this courtroom. Mark it well. The world is not going to long remember what you or I say here. Day after tomorrow it will be forgotten. But this, however, will long endure. Here, in this courtroom, and courtrooms all across America, the American people will gather to see that justice, individual justice, justice, not war, individual justice is in fact being done.

The very President of the United States through his officers will have to come into courtrooms and lay out evidence on which specific matters can be judged, and juries of citizens will gather to sit and judge that evidence democratically, to mold and shape and refine our sense of justice.

See that flag, Mr. Reid? That's the flag of the United States of America. That flag will fly there long after this is all forgotten. That flag still stands for freedom. You know it always will. Mr. Custody Officer. Stand him down.

***************************************************************

On 22 December 2001, Richard Colvin Reid, a 29-year-old British citizen flying as a passenger on American Airlines Flight 63 from Paris to Miami, attempted to ignite what other passengers described as a wire protruding from one of his shoes. When Reid attacked a flight attendant who confronted him about this suspicious activity, other passengers responded to the commotion and rushed to help subdue him. According to various accounts, one French man reached over the seat to pin Reid's arms as he struggled while other passengers held his legs; a doctor on board sedated Reid while another passenger wielded a fire extinguisher as a weapon. After passengers finally restrained Reid using belts and anything else available for the purpose, they were eventually able to remove his shoe.

What Reid had been trying to ignite was a fuse leading to plastic explosives hidden in the sole of his high-top suede sport shoe -- enough explosives, prosecutors later maintained, to blow a hole in the fuselage of the plane and kill all 197 people aboard. (His plot failed, authorities speculated, because his shoes were moist from sweat.) Flight 63 was diverted to Boston, where Reid was taken into custody.

As U.S. federal prosecutors prepared their case against "shoe bomber" Reid on eight charges (including attempted murder and attempted use of a weapon of mass destruction), he surprised them in October 2002 by pleading guilty to all charges in order to spare his family pain and publicity. Reid maintained that he was a member of al-Qaida, pledged his support to Osama bin Laden, and declared himself an enemy of the United States. Prosecutors and the FBI said witnesses had reported Reid was present at al-Qaida training camps, and that he had help making the bomb from an al-Qaida bomb maker.

At his hearing on 30 January 2003, Reid was sentenced to life imprisonment by Judge William Young. After admitting his guilt to the court for the record, Reid also admitted his "allegiance to Osama bin Laden, to Islam, and to the religion of Allah," defiantly stated "I think I ought not apologize for my actions," and told the court "I am at war with your country." Judge Young then delivered the statement quoted above, a stinging condemnation of Reid in particular and terrorists in general.

******************************************************************

If we forget what they have done, we will be targets once more - PB

God bless all those we lost, and their families who lost them. And may God be with us all as we go on.
 
So tell me Mr Devil Fan, do you wish to change the description of The Lobby by single handedly removing the portion which states "Come on in and talk about anything."?

If you are truly so against those "'American Boys" maybe you would like to tell us which Democracy it is that you reside in? Hmmmm?

Maybe we should just stick to you keeping your Anti American Oppinions to yourself, huh?
 
The very fact that I state my opinion is more American than blindly follwing like a sheep.

I'm not against American boys, I am against American boys dropping bombs on children. I just think it's sad that there is no day for them, because they aren't 'American.'

If Thomas Jefferson were alive the first thing he would do is puke.

Michael
 
Mr Devil Worshiper:
You and I have no need for further banter. I was not stating any oppinions, one way or another. I have much more details about who and what I am commemorating and greaving, but I am sure that to speak them to the likes of you is futile.

Good day to you sir. :angry:
 
Ok so calling me a "devil worshipper" is intelligent?
I don't worship the Devil, I'm a fan of the "Devils" Hockey team.

Your comments had more than a mourning in them , it had a certain popular ideogly behind it. Don't expect to post an opinion like that and not get called out about it (espescially in a Democratic society).

And by the way I didn't resort to name calling.... you did.

Michael
 
Just for the record folks:

God bless all those we lost, and their families who lost them. And may God be with us all as we go on.

That statement was not only for the "Americans" that were lost in this fight, but for all lives, big and small. :(
 
I never hold a grudge.....too long :D

Oh and sorry bout the Devil crack, couldn't help myself. :0
 
Too bad there's not a large microwave we could stick that Reid twerp into and be done with him. :0

Anyway, if you look in the dictionary I think our system of government fit more in the category of Bureaucracy than Democracy.
 
He stands on the steps of his dorm, watching the rain and lightning fall.
Reaching into his pocket he pulles out lighter, cutter, and Cohiba Robusto (ISOM). Looking around he sees friends standing next to him: the freshmen girl from Africa, the freshmen girl from Sweden, the Spanish T.A. from southern Spain, and one of his best friends.
They stand there and talk of things. He looks up and sees all the flags flying together at the International Dorm.
He thinks to himself, wow, already 1:45 in the morning. Hey, today is 9-11. He pauses to reflect on things, then turns back to his friends and continues to talk.
Because, he knows life goes on. Regardless of what happens, regardless of who is president, who owns the most bombs, the core ideas and beliefs that this nation was founded on in time past, will continue on into the future. He is glad to be an American, whatever that means, and is greatful for all that has come his way.

G.B. America dudes.


To the men (and women) out there figting for us, all I can say is "Thank you."

:thumbs:
 
Thanks PB! Don't want to step on toes :) , Don't want to piss anyone off ??? But if you look up the name Philip Mastrandrea on the list of people killed in the towers that day. He was not a "child" in the sense mentioned above, but a "Child" in my aunts heart. My view may be a bit on the not so politically correct side of this bull**** world we live in, but then again, politically correct is for pussy's. So if killing a few to stop the many from dying in the future is what has to be done. I have nothing else to say.
 
mikedevilsfan said:
God bless all of the innocent children who were bombed back to the stoneage by our 'American Boys' because we want to rule the world.
You know I don't even know what to say in response to such a nieve, short sighted, ignorant remark.

If only the world was such a perfect place that no one would have to die in order to insure the life, safety, and freedom of others. Our graveyards would be much smaller places.

I say thank you to all who are willing to give all to defend my life, and the lives of my family.
 
gibu said:
mikedevilsfan said:
God bless all of the innocent children who were bombed back to the stoneage by our 'American Boys' because we want to rule the world.
You know I don't even know what to say in response to such a nieve, short sighted, ignorant remark.

If only the world was such a perfect place that no one would have to die in order to insure the life, safety, and freedom of others. Our graveyards would be much smaller places.

I say thank you to all who are willing to give all to defend my life, and the lives of my family.
(quote) You know I don't even know what to say in response to such a nieve, short sighted, ignorant remark.

If only the world was such a perfect place that no one would have to die in order to insure the life, safety, and freedom of others. Our graveyards would be much smaller places.

No one has to die. What's ignorant is that the American public is swallowing what this administration is saying wholesale- no questions asked. THey hit us- we hit them back. Hit who back? Those wern't Iraqi's on those planes. where's the connection?

I say thank you to all who are willing to give all to defend my life, and the lives of my family.

That's much eaiser than saying : iraq isn't threatning us, and in fact no army has crossed our borders since the British. Make no mistake our children are dying in a political vye for power. So what's worse- me objecting to that (i.e. Bring them all home now) or you saying thanks for your sevice, I support you. (Stay there and die so we can put yet another dictator puppet in power).

When will you stand up and say enough is enough, when we invade canada? WHere do you draw the line, or do you have a line. Can bush do anything in the name of defending our "freedom." Just like Vietnam right, defending our freedom from the evil commies who were going to one day swim to america with their AK-47's. Well there was a group of people who protested that, and history bore them out to be true, and the archie bunker's of the world wrong.

The problem is that your so caught up in the new jingoism, you can't see a bold face lie being told to your face.
who's ignorant?

Bush has gotten a lot of miliage out of 9/11. What about all the other scares that were all false. Is it possible that it was an isolated incident by a bunch of extreme wacko's? Keep your eyes glued to the TV for the next threat. Iran, Syria, Korea.
I say if we have to send people over to fight yet another war- you should go, and let the soldiers have a rest.

Anyone else remember the days when Americans were allowed to question there government without being called "anti- American, or Ignorant, or haters of America and freedom?" Well stick around pretty soon you won't be able to remember the days when we could speak our minds.....

Michael
 
You know, the fourth plane that crashed on 9/11 killed inocent children as a direct result of Americans standing up to terrorists. Should we asume they killed there own children because we want to rule the world?? It was a plan those passengers had and implimented and part of the result was children died? I would asume the loss of innocent life was unintentional when creating the plan to stand up to the terrorsits, but perhaps not. Now that you have opened my eyes I can see how they were really just wanting to rule the world and it had nothing to do with defense. Thanks man for being so much more enlightened then I used to be.
 
Hello, Archie Bunker here...

Regardless of our opinions, actions and policies of the current administration, can we not all agree that terrorism has to be combatted? Something has to be done. I'm not smart enough to know if what we are doing is right or wrong or necessary. Terrorism is elusive. They are too cowardly to step out of the caves and stand up before the world. They are not an army. They are not a nation. They are a bunch of cowards. They are un-identifiable until we see them in an airplane headed for a building or we see their shoe smoking. If you know of a better way to fight this ambiguous target, I would love to hear about it.

As far as our 'American Boys...' and the reference to Vietnam, can today "Really" be compared with Vietnam? I was born after the Vietnam War ended as were you Mike. I cannot speak for our countries sentiment during that time. I have studied it a little and/but cannot seem to draw a parallel to today. Our 'American Boys' are obeying orders today as they were during Vietnam. Should we spit at our soldiers when they come home from duty as they did in the 60's? Should we call them names and chastise them. Should we scream "Baby Killer!" at them when we see them eating at a restaurant with their families? HELL NO!

The terrorists and the nations who supported them must be delt with in my opinion. Is it odd that we did not go to Afghanistan or Iran first? Yes, maybe it is but again, I do not have the knowledge or intelligence of the leaders of our "Boys." I will not comment on decisions made about something when the only knowledge I have of it has been aired by the cable news networks.

Today is a day of remembrance. Remember Joe's cousin Philip. Remember, the school children who were on a field trip to the Twin Towers that day and perished. Remember the fire fighters and the policeman and the paramedics who gave up their lives attempting to unselfishly save another. Remember the men, women and children on the planes that were turned into American owned missles. Remember the men and woman who sat in their cubicles earning a days wages while a spineless terrorist flew a hijacked plane into them.

Call me John Wayne, Archie Bunker, North Carolina Hillbilly/Redneck or whatever you want, but this is how I see it.

Remember Today! Remember those who died and their loved ones. Remember also the soldiers and their families. They are experiencing sadness too.

We can have a pissing contest later!
 
I remember. I am also 150% behind the war. I also come here for cigars and the friendships (and not neccessarily in that order). I argue political and such over at CF and people are free to read my opinions there.

What I will say is good job PB.

What I will say to Mike. I appreciate your view point and how passionate you are about it. Understand also that many of us are as passionate on the other side of the fence. In a free country you are entitled to your opinion but never - ever - forget that we are entitled to our own as well.

*stepping off the soap box and getting back to being with friends and enjoying cigars*

Sam
 
Hey guy’s, I was not trying to turn this into a pissing contest. As was eloquently stated above “this is America!” We all have the right to speak our minds no matter which side of the coin you are on. That’s what makes us great. Mikes point is valid in many ways, so is everyone else’s. My view is that there is reality, and there is what everyone wishes for. Sadly, reality is what we live in today. We may not want to face it but that is why “life sucks and you must live with it”. I don’t believe that Iraq hade anything to do with 9/11, But then again I believe that if the opportunity presented itself they would have lined up willingly to help the terrorist that day. I also believe {and this wont sit well with many} that our great President :lookup: and his cohorts have done more damage to our country than any group of terrorist ever could. Not only will we pay for their recklessness economically and politically, but our children and their children will also. So what do you do about it? Sit by sheepishly and let things happen? Or do you stand up and take action no matter what your point may be. We are at the point of no return, we can’t have a group hug with the world and say we are all brothers so lets put this all aside and star fresh new world. Just not going to happen. We have to play with the cards dealt to us by our government, some may like it and other not, but the one thing we have is to be there for each other.
As I sit here and smoke a cigar that was given to me in my cousins honor, watching the news, reading your posts, looking at a piece of the trade center and a picture of my cousin that was given to me by my father, I think, why!
 
Why indeed my brother. As for the group hug, I know we can't have a world wide one, but we CAN have a CP one!!

Come 'er bro :love: ;)
 
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